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  1. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowerider View Post
    Let me rephrase...

    The bigger question is why hasn't the full power of our state/federal gov't not been deployed to figure out why the carp went belly up? Seems we were given a gift. The carp problem in KY lake is a mere drop in the bucket to the overall problem and I'm not blaming our state for not coming up with a solution. Obviously there's a disease out there that affects these fish...meanwhile we're talking about carp tournaments. We put man on the moon; we can figure why a fish got a disease.
    BUT, if you've lived here long enough or got involved in any political process to help protect our states resources you'd know why faith is lost with KDFWR. I have absolutely no problem going on record saying they have a greater interest in creating a new sustainable industry than protecting our native wildlife. And that should concern all of you. Politics at its best... Time will tell if the new head honcho really changes anything.
    IMHO ... the state/fed govt have bigger fish to fry, than worry about the asian carp infestation. Even if the carp problem gets cleaned up in KY, you'd have to totally eradicate every single one of them in every single waterway & pond ... or they'd be back in a matter of years. We also don't know if the deaths of those carp below the dams even WAS a "disease" ... could have just been a fluke "condition".

    I doubt very seriously if the KDFWR has a greater interest in a sustainable industry with these carp. If they invade & ruin some of our best waterways, and sport fishing collapses due to their presence ... do you really think commercial fishing licenses are going to put the same amount of money in the coffers as all the in & out of state fishing licenses sold to people that fish those waters ??

    We may have to be content with having their numbers "controlled" ... since there may not be a chemical or biological solution that rids us of JUST THEM. Remember, we imported them to keep aquaculture & wastewater ponds clean ... then floods put them into the main arteries of our waterways. We have to be careful with whatever methods get used to rid us of them, or even deplete their numbers to a point where they're not detrimental to the sportfish population.

    ... pappy

  2. #26
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    Jan 2013
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    spring die off according to fish @ wildlife

    FRANKFORT, Ky. Research indicates a condition similar to “the bends” in divers likely played a role in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Asian carp in two western Kentucky rivers last month The die-off of invasive silver carp happened in the Cumberland River below Lake Barkley dam and Tennessee River below Kentucky Lake dam “Preliminary results show they’ve got bubbles in the gills,” said Aquatic Nuisance Species Biologist Paul Wilkes of the Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife Resources. “You can see it very clearly Gas bubble disease can occur in water supersaturated with dissolved gases, and biologists believe it is a contributing factor in this case Gas supersaturation is something that can happen below dams,” Wilkes said. “When a fish is breathing this water with gas supersaturation it essentially causes an air embolism in the gill, which is similar to a diver getting the bends. A gas bubble will get trapped in the gill tissue of a fish and prevent blood circulation.”

    Complete article can be found on fish and wildlife web page, pick fish tab then the more tab.

  3. #27
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    Here is the link to the full article mentioned above.


    http://fw.ky.gov/Fish/Pages/KY-Barkley-Fishkill.aspx

  4. #28
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    thanks, peter

    thanks, i couuld note copy the link last night. not sure what i was doing wrong.

  5. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by clc View Post
    thanks, i couuld note copy the link last night. not sure what i was doing wrong.
    Just left click on it and it should open the link.

  6. #30
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    Interesting But something else might have happened

    Quote Originally Posted by clc View Post
    FRANKFORT, Ky. Research indicates a condition similar to “the bends” in divers likely played a role in the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Asian carp in two western Kentucky rivers last month The die-off of invasive silver carp happened in the Cumberland River below Lake Barkley dam and Tennessee River below Kentucky Lake dam “Preliminary results show they’ve got bubbles in the gills,” said Aquatic Nuisance Species Biologist Paul Wilkes of the Kentucky Department of Fish and Wildlife Resources. “You can see it very clearly Gas bubble disease can occur in water supersaturated with dissolved gases, and biologists believe it is a contributing factor in this case Gas supersaturation is something that can happen below dams,” Wilkes said. “When a fish is breathing this water with gas supersaturation it essentially causes an air embolism in the gill, which is similar to a diver getting the bends. A gas bubble will get trapped in the gill tissue of a fish and prevent blood circulation.”

    Complete article can be found on fish and wildlife web page, pick fish tab then the more tab.

    I wonder why this only effected the silver carp and not the native fish species that live in the same highly saturated water? One would think that such a physical property as highly dissolved oxygen in the water would have a effect on all the fish that were swimming and breathing that highly oxygenated water.

    The key to this might be the brain lesions that were discovered in the silver carps brain tissue. I think that the article said something about bleeding in the brain tissue.

    Also I wonder if the outgassing of oxygen bubbles might have occurred after death? If the fish were breathing highly oxygenated water the O2 Pressure in their blood might have been higher when they were alive and after they died the floated to the surface where they were captured. I'm speculating about the floating to the surface but it's a good speculation as if they sank they would not have been collected for study. So they must have been floating on the surface in order for them to be found and collected by the biologists. That would make more sense to me. But I'm not for sure as the article didn't say that did it? Oh Well. After they died the super amount of oxygen in the blood vessels of the gills allowed the gas bubbles to come out of the gill's capillaries. Maybe that's what happened.

    Why are Catfish not affected by the high oxygen content in the water below those dams. Many other fish species are caught right below the dams all the time and yet they are not dying of this high oxygen water. Maybe the new species have not adapted to this type of water where the native fish have figured out how to adapt to this type of water quality. But that's not really making sense to me.

    Id like to see the results from the tissue sample studies. There are a lot of things about disease in both human's and other animals that we just don't know much about ... yet. This might be another one of those cases.

    I do however wish and hope that some day someone (anyone) can figure out how to get rid of these silver carp and other grass carp species so as to preserve our native fish species. But I fear that won't happen. We might have to just get used to chasing a new fish species if we want to continue to fish at all. Hopefully that's not going to be the case. I'd hate to have to give up fishing for bass and crappie due to the fear of getting hit in the face while driving the boat at high speed by a 30 lb. flying Silver Carp. Not to mention that these silver carp take up most all the edible biomass in the waters and leave little for our young native fish to feed on. This may only get worse if these silver carp continue to expand their numbers. Which leads me to another thing that I learned in my Wildlife Biology 400 level class. Animal populations have bio feed back mechanisms that help to control their own populations. When there are too many of one species in a single area the spread disease more easily. Maybe this is what happened. Maybe one of the fish was sick and he spread it to the other's below the day as the small area below the dam was so full of other fish that fish to fish spread of the disease was made easier? That can happen with humans when they are all confined in a small area such as a school and the flu is going around. .

  7. #31
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    Feb 2011
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    And the Mississippi catfish farmers aren't paying a dime...

  8. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moveon View Post
    I wonder why this only effected the silver carp and not the native fish species that live in the same highly saturated water? One would think that such a physical property as highly dissolved oxygen in the water would have a effect on all the fish that were swimming and breathing that highly oxygenated water.

    The key to this might be the brain lesions that were discovered in the silver carps brain tissue. I think that the article said something about bleeding in the brain tissue.

    Also I wonder if the outgassing of oxygen bubbles might have occurred after death? If the fish were breathing highly oxygenated water the O2 Pressure in their blood might have been higher when they were alive and after they died the floated to the surface where they were captured. I'm speculating about the floating to the surface but it's a good speculation as if they sank they would not have been collected for study. So they must have been floating on the surface in order for them to be found and collected by the biologists. That would make more sense to me. But I'm not for sure as the article didn't say that did it? Oh Well. After they died the super amount of oxygen in the blood vessels of the gills allowed the gas bubbles to come out of the gill's capillaries. Maybe that's what happened.

    Why are Catfish not affected by the high oxygen content in the water below those dams. Many other fish species are caught right below the dams all the time and yet they are not dying of this high oxygen water. Maybe the new species have not adapted to this type of water where the native fish have figured out how to adapt to this type of water quality. But that's not really making sense to me.

    Id like to see the results from the tissue sample studies. There are a lot of things about disease in both human's and other animals that we just don't know much about ... yet. This might be another one of those cases.

    I do however wish and hope that some day someone (anyone) can figure out how to get rid of these silver carp and other grass carp species so as to preserve our native fish species. But I fear that won't happen. We might have to just get used to chasing a new fish species if we want to continue to fish at all. Hopefully that's not going to be the case. I'd hate to have to give up fishing for bass and crappie due to the fear of getting hit in the face while driving the boat at high speed by a 30 lb. flying Silver Carp. Not to mention that these silver carp take up most all the edible biomass in the waters and leave little for our young native fish to feed on. This may only get worse if these silver carp continue to expand their numbers. Which leads me to another thing that I learned in my Wildlife Biology 400 level class. Animal populations have bio feed back mechanisms that help to control their own populations. When there are too many of one species in a single area the spread disease more easily. Maybe this is what happened. Maybe one of the fish was sick and he spread it to the other's below the day as the small area below the dam was so full of other fish that fish to fish spread of the disease was made easier? That can happen with humans when they are all confined in a small area such as a school and the flu is going around. .
    these fish feed in the top 18 inches of water.......this is where the over oxygenated water is located. I think biologists are spot on.

    Later,

    Geo

  9. #33
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    Apr 2009
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    I can tell you that I've talked with lots of people around the lakes and most are skeptical about the government's answer regarding the massive dieoff. They better get a handle on those trash fish or they could ruin property prices and the fishing...bad deal.

  10. #34
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    Frankfort
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    Quote Originally Posted by redearhoosier View Post
    I can tell you that I've talked with lots of people around the lakes and most are skeptical about the government's answer regarding the massive dieoff. They better get a handle on those trash fish or they could ruin property prices and the fishing...bad deal.
    No offense, but lots of people are skeptical about whether or not we landed on the moon.

  11. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red Shad View Post
    I just got back from Kentucky lake for the fourth trip this year. Each time I've noticed the number of asian carp have gotten larger and larger. It's not just a few it's hundreds of them at a time. I haven't heard nothing from the department of fish and wildlife about correcting this matter other then carp tournament. Fellas that's not going to do it. I don't know if there's anything that can be done. I do know that unless something is done one of the finest fisheries in United States will be ruined it in the next few years. What are your thoughts about this.
    Well here's one that most people don't know about.

    The Kentucky River Authority has spent millions on repairing dams AND Locks for on #1, #2, #3, and #4. Asian carp from the Ohio will get all the way up into the Frankfort pool. They are funded by fees collected on water bills from water users in the Kentucky River watershed.

    The claim is that opening locks will bring economic boom and commerce up the Kentucky. That's a load of crap. In KRA meeting minutes, they briefly addressed a fisherman's concern about the invasion of carp. They blew it off, stating "they're already there".

    1. Why are millions spent on locks that will only benefit a few?
    2. Where is US Fish and Wildlife and environmental studies for Asian carp invasion?
    3. Why is Fish and Wildlife quite about the opening of 4 locks and the impact of carp?

  12. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyriver View Post
    Well here's one that most people don't know about.

    The Kentucky River Authority has spent millions on repairing dams AND Locks for on #1, #2, #3, and #4. Asian carp from the Ohio will get all the way up into the Frankfort pool. They are funded by fees collected on water bills from water users in the Kentucky River watershed.

    The claim is that opening locks will bring economic boom and commerce up the Kentucky. That's a load of crap. In KRA meeting minutes, they briefly addressed a fisherman's concern about the invasion of carp. They blew it off, stating "they're already there".

    1. Why are millions spent on locks that will only benefit a few?
    2. Where is US Fish and Wildlife and environmental studies for Asian carp invasion?
    3. Why is Fish and Wildlife quite about the opening of 4 locks and the impact of carp?
    I hear what you are saying locks providing a way for the carp to go further up the KY River.

    I am not totally familiar with what the KY River does when it floods.
    Question: Does the dam become submerged when it floods providing a passage over the Dam?

    Let me know.

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