FLOAT&FLY

[garyt]

I have read numerous articles on this ,but i am confused about how you rig the 3 way swivel. is the bobber tied to it ,if so how much line ,or is it clipped?

[elnutsmalljaws]

No need for the 3-way for FNF. I use 6 lb green P line and wrap the line 3 times around the bottom clip of the bobber. Works great for me. Landed a 6-4 and 6-6 plus several over 3 on this setup without problems (See posts on KY Board) I know several of the guides use Fireline from the reel to one swivel thn Vanish or Transition from the 2nd ring to the jig and hook the bobber to the 3rd ring. This is all well and good and I am sure it works but too much trouble for me. Too many knots to tie and with wet cold hands all more difficult. More knots more chances to break off I believe.

Tight Lines

[Fish2win]

Thats practical wisdom El/ thre knot is the weakest part of your line. The more knots you have the greater the chance of having one break.
This is also why a very limber light action rod and a reel that has the ability to back reel is important. I use 4lb low vis sensation I tried using 6 or 8 as many others have mentioned but just did not get the strikes. I use duck feather fly's I think they fall slower and have a more natural look to the fish.I have had a lot of luck with ones that has either a touch of orange or light blue.
With all the talk about the FnF I might add this guys. This is an alternate finesse method that works when the conditions are very bad. The water very cold and the fish suspending. It is not a cure all for winter time slow bites. I fish the fly with sucussess but I still catch more smallies between Dec and Feb on a hair fly with pork or Silver Buddy. A lot of guys tie one on use it for a while dont get bit and give up.It is like in the summer. If the fish are hitting a PnG you can crank or throw a topwater all day long and not get bit.
It is another tool. Fish2win

[fishbum]

WRONG!!!!!
The wraps around the bobber will weaken your line MUCH more than the Palomar Knot will. How many fish have you guys that wrap the line lost by breakoffs at the bobber?
The Coan Method may create 3 knots, but if you use the Palomar Knot, there is no weakening of the line by a knot. Tests indicate that the Palomar is actually as strong as the line.
Not to mention the fact that the Power Pro or Fire Line is a stronger line that you can tie that almost NO smallmouth COULD break anyway. Only the Fluorocarbon line will break and you can use up to 8 LB test with Fluorocarbon although I recommend no bigger than 6 Lb.
Unless you rewrap your line about every 10 to 15 casts the wraps will compress and fish will compress the line. Each time you weaken the line more by crushing it, or it wraps around itself cutting into itself.
Jim Dicken
www.FloatandFly.com

[crappiepappy]

>WRONG!!!!!
>The wraps around the bobber will
>weaken your line MUCH more
>than the Palomar Knot will.
>How many fish have you
>guys that wrap the line
>lost by breakoffs at the
>bobber?
>The Coan Method may create 3
>knots, but if you use
>the Palomar Knot, there is
>no weakening of the line
>by a knot. Tests indicate
>that the Palomar is actually
>as strong as the line.
>
>Not to mention the fact that
>the Power Pro or Fire
>Line is a stronger line
>that you can tie that
>almost NO smallmouth COULD break
>anyway. Only the Fluorocarbon line
>will break and you can
>use up to 8 LB
>test with Fluorocarbon although I
>recommend no bigger than 6
>Lb.
>Unless you rewrap your line about
>every 10 to 15 casts
>the wraps will compress and
>fish will compress the line.
>Each time you weaken the
>line more by crushing it,
>or it wraps around itself
>cutting into itself.
>Jim Dicken
>www.FloatandFly.com

You guys are the 'experts' on this ... I've never FnF fished for Bass. But, for the sake of arguement (in a gentlemanly manner, of course):
WHY would a line "wrapped" around a solid brass bobber clamp, be any more likely to break than a "knot" tied around a solid brass ring of a 3way swivel ?? The wrapped line isn't "crushed" by the power of the bobber spring. If it is wrapped in side by side coils on the bobber hook, what's to make it cross over itself and thus dig into itself, when the pressure of fighting a fish is applied ? A wrapped line is the same pound test, anywhere along its length ... and any knot is a crushed line at the point where the "wraps" go around the main line. Even a Palomar is double wrapped around the hook/clamp .. plus the crushing effect of the "knot" wrapping. Why would one be any stronger than the other ? The dynamics just don't seem to be all that much different.

I'm thinking in terms of "perfect" knot tying, and side by side line wraps on the bobber stem ... not haphazardly doing either one. It would seem that side by side line wraps would be just as strong as the double looped line, of a Palomar knot, wrapped around the swivel ring. Could it be the flurocarbon line that's at fault here ?? Does it not take well to being wrapped in tiny coils ? How do the two methods compare - when flurocarbon line is used from reel to jig (tied vs wrapped) ... taking out the extra pound test factor of PowerPro/Fireline ?? And if you "need" to use PP/FL ... why not wrap IT around the bobber stem, and tie the flurocarbon to it using UNI knots ??

I'm not asking these questions to start any arguments, polarize the believers in the two versions, or compromise the loyalty of either camp to their respective mentors ... I'm seriously interested in hearing both sides views. ...... cp

[redneckshadrap]

The real difference I have found in the 3-way/vs/wrap is the 3-way gives the fly a different action. You can actually "bounce the bobber" in place.

It's easy to see rather than explain though.,,,

Redneckshadrap
www.thecreekbank.com
redneckshadrap@insightbb.com

[crappiepappy]

> The real difference I have
>found in the 3-way/vs/wrap is
>the 3-way gives the fly
>a different action. You can
>actually "bounce the bobber" in
>place.
>
> It's easy to see rather
>than explain though.,,,
>

I can visualize that !! "Rocking" the bobber, rather than actually pulling the bobber towards you. And you would be imparting action on the leader/jig (by way of the 3way swivel) .. without bringing the bobber towards the boat. I assume that's done by "shaking" the rod tip/line (imparting the tiniest amount of pull on the swivel). Point taken.

But that still doesn't address the issue of - 1knot/3line wraps around the bobber clamp .. versus .. 2knots/swivel ring hooked in bobber clamp -- and which one (if either) is the stronger connection. The jury is still out on that one ........... cp

[eddie stewart]

I was reading all of your posts with great interest and I learned alot. I am a novice at this method but I had an Idea. Why not use a slip bobber and set the depth to your liking? I am curious to read your responses. I have used this method while crappie fishing, but I must admit I have never hooked a big smallie.

[crappiepappy]

>I was reading all of your
>posts with great interest and
>I learned alot. I am
>a novice at this method
>but I had an Idea.
>Why not use a slip
>bobber and set the depth
>to your liking? I am
>curious to read your responses.
>I have used this method
>while crappie fishing, but I
>must admit I have never
>hooked a big smallie.

The use of a slip float has been a point of contention ... much as the pear shaped plastic float vs the weighted styrofoam float. Some say they use it with good results, while others say it doesn't work well. A 1/32oz-1/16oz jig does seem to have trouble pulling wet line thru a slip float ... and since flurocarbon line sinks faster than mono, it would only seemingly compound the problem. The type of "retainer" used would/could also interfere with the cast, by hanging up (even momentarily) in the line guides, when casting. By "retainer", I'm referring to the "thread knot", "rubber slip-on ball", or "2hole or 4hole plastic dogbone/ladder shaped" slip float stopper. The "thread" & "rubber" ones are prone to sliding on the line, from hanging in the guides or tip-eye. The plastic ones are prone to hanging in the tip-eye, or crimping the line. Either one has the possiblity of hanging up in the line on the line spool of the reel. And, if you are using a braid for the main line, it is "slicker" than mono/fluro ... which could compound the, "slipping" of the stopper, problem.
The use of the float/jig (aka FnF method) for Crappie, usually doesn't seem to require as long a cast, as it does when fishing for Bass.
All this "info" is just IMHO .... as I'm no expert on FnF -- heck, I'm not even a "novice" at it....LOL!!! ....luck2ya ...cp

[redneckshadrap]

Terry,

Fishing for smallmouth in clear water is a task. Most of the waters in Dale or Cumberland are gin clear most of the time. So you have to stay off them or look for wind.....

Wind will pull the jig up out of the strike zone. The wind we fished in last Wed, Thurs, and Sat on Dale Hollow would have really pulled them up.

Billy

Redneckshadrap
www.thecreekbank.com
redneckshadrap@insightbb.com

[opie13]

You need the weighted bobber to help you cast and I don't think the jig would be heavy enough to pull the line through the slip bobber.

[STONEWALL]

I tried the three way swivel this weekend it really does change the action. The fluro leader disappears in the water.