herrington ecoli?

[flippindrew]

i keep hearing things about herrington being off limits right now because of an ecoli problem?

[roberte68]

I think this comes from a news story in the paper a week or so ago. They have found high amounts of bacteria in the water but they don't know if it is related to run off from animal waste from nearby farms or open sewer/defective septic type lines running into the lake. Herrington was just one of the lakes they talked about. The others were in the same general geographic area of the state. But none of the lakes were made off-limits, I don't think. Personally I would think twice about eating anything from there. I live within a stones throw of Herrington (literally) and I drive to Cumberland to fish.

[gettingonefishin]

I contacted Ky fish and wildlife about the ecoli problem on Herrington. I was told that ecoli measurements were below normal on the lake. This was started by a reporter with false infotmation. KFW says its best to cook ur fish before consumption but if ya like em raw go ahead but they suggest not to eat to much uncooked. So go on over there and catch ya some fish. I will maybe be there this weekend.

Good Luck where ever you are.

[Moose1am]

Some Bacteria background. I worked in an environmental laboratory and conducted the bacteria counts in that lab. I got the lab certified by the State to do these tests commercially for drinking water. So I have some expertise in this subject. Our lab also conducted sampling service for the area's Fortune 500 firms as well.

The sampling methods are as important as the actually testing of the samples. Developing a sampling strategy is critical and it should address the scope of the problem under study.

E. coli bacteria are present in the gut of all warm blooded animals. These bacteria live in our bodies without doing us harm. Now there are some exotic special E. coli bacteria that we all have heard about. These exotic and rare E. coli bacteria are the flesh eating strain. But these are not the common E. Coli bacteria that are normally found in our guts. E. Coli bacteria can't live very long when they are not in the ideal environment. Once they are they require a warm moist environment with plenty of nutrients to survive.

Biologist use E. Coli as an Indicator Species. Sort of like the Coal Miners used a canary to tell them if there was poison gas in the mines. But the canary can die from other causes so it's not always accurate. Like the canary in the mine the presence of E. Coli bacteria may mean that there are other pathogen bacteria present as well. Pathogens are forms of bacteria that cause disease. Cholera, Typhoid are two examples of pathogens. Now just because E. Coli bacteria are present does not mean that the pathogen are present. We test for E coli because it's easier to test for. It's much harder to isolate and test for the other pathogens. Call the E coli test a screening test.

Water samples are taken and filtered under suction though micro pore filters. These filter will capture the bacteria and let water pass though the filter due to the pore size. Once any bacteria are collected on the filter the filter is put inside a glass dish with nutrients and incubated for 24 hours. The special nutrients in the glass dish are designed to make any E coli bacteria grow into visible colonies of bacteria that have a green metallic sheen. After growing for 24 hours and doubling their numbers ever 20 minutes you end up with millions of bacteria. The analysts then counts the number of bacteria colonies on the filter and records the result. If too many colonies are growing and it's too hard to count a dilution sample is used to count the sample. The sample can be diluted with pure filter water that's sterile and then the test can be run again or at the same time. Multiple dilutions may be preformed on the original sample and run simultaneously to speed up the test results. Most likely the one of the samples will have the right number of bacteria colonies on the filter that makes it easy to count them. Correction on the number of bacteria in the original sample are made and the reports are forward to the client. There are other tests that can be performed using nutrient broth and multiple test tubes that are inoculated with different dilutions of the original water sample. These test tubes contain nutrient broth that will cause the bacteria to grow rapidly. The latter test is not as good as the former filter test IMHO. You can read all about this testing in the book called "Standard Methods". Most libraries will have a copy of this book and you can most likely find a copy of this book at a college library or at the local health dept.

Just because one sample comes back positive for E. Coli there is no reason to get excited and stop fishing. Only if the lake was heavily contaminated would there be any cause for concern. And the concern is not due to the present of E coli bacteria but because there may be some other forms of PATHOGENIC Bacteria present. Cooking the fish kills most bacteria. Although cooking the fish may not remove toxins that bacteria have already produced. Cooking the fish may not remove other toxic chemical that can be present in fish such as methyl mercury or pcb. For those we depend on the Health dept, EPA or DNR's to give fish consumption advisories. Most of the times you can eat fish but will just have to reduce how much fish you eat each week.

I wrote this to help you understand what's going on behind the scenes in the labs that are sampling and testing.

There are quick and easy ways to figure out the source of the E Coli or leaking sewage. Running a dye though the sewers can show if there are leaks in the pipes. Smoke can be used as well to show leaks in sewer pipes. Inadequate field beds can also create this problem. That's another story as there are huge costs involved in fixing that problem.

I am glad that Patoka Lake does not allow development around the lake. This prevents homes from being built and using septic tanks next to the shorelines where the lake can be contaminated with sewage. Not all ground is good for septic tanks.

Also animals that live around a lake can contaminate the water with their feces. Ducks, Raccoons, Deer, Dogs and even cats may be putting E. Coli bacteria into the lake.

I would like to know how many samples were taken, When and where they where taken. And what the lake conditions were like when the samples were taken to better understand what's going on. But I am hoping that others will know that and take appropriate actions.

If there was a problem people would be getting sick and that would be easy to recognize.

I use to work at a recreational lake that would have 1000 people swimming on the 4th of July some years. The county health dept took water samples from the shallow water area every month and sometimes those samples didn't pass. We would be required to throw out chlorine tables into the shallow water to kill any bacteria.

If anyone saw the movie caddyshack you may remember Bill Murry finding the candy bar in the middle of the swimming pool. LOL That had to be one of the funnies scenes in the entire move.

[Bonefish]

Thanks, Moose. This helps me understand things alot better. You get these reports a lot of times not knowing how to respond to them. I think if you cook your fish and not eat them every day you will be ok unless there is a serious problem which comes with an alert hopefully.

[greentrout]

Information on sampling and planning in the Dix River Watershed: http://www.dixriverwatershed.org/whatstheplan.html. It includes a link to the 303 (d) list (Kentuck's list of impaired waters). The 303(d) list reports streams and lakes that are impaired for one or more pollutants.

[roberte68]

A reporter getting something wrong, they never do that! :7