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I'm not referring to county or city owned lakes. I am referring to State Lakes. You do what you want with your lake that you are managing. It seems to be working pretty well. I was discussing state lakes and the new permit fee instituted last season.
Sorry for the misunderstanding. I thought you were referring to tournament fees in general. But actually some of the same things apply to state lakes, as they too are public properties. Since I used to work for IDNR, and still know many of the folks who do, I think they also beleive in general that any activity on the public lands for which a person has to pay money to a third party in order to participate, is to be considered a commercial use. That distinction may seem like not a big deal to you, but is does to a great many other people.
Mike,
I'm just curious but what is Boggs doing with the money that is generated by the tournaments at Boggs? Not trying to be a smart#$# but it would be nice to see some improvements at the lake other than camping facilities and a miniature golf course.
Whatever happened to the idea of building a release boat for tournament use? The way I understood it was you had a boat that could be used you just needed to build it. If that's the case I'm sure there are several that would volunteer time to build a release boat that would be free to the tournaments in order to release the fish away from the marina. I know I'd be glad to help out.
I think this sort of thing is everyones concern. For this additional fee what are we going to see in return? Currently I never have seen a IDNR release boat at any tournament for their use. You see this in other states (Kentucky). You often see CO's at other state tournaments as well. The only officials I've ever seen at an Indiana facility was the ones insuring you had your sticker and if you didn't they would gladly sell you one. It seems that all Indiana wants to do is find more ways to make money and put nothing back into it. Here again I see other states improving ramps and enlarging existing ramps without charging any additional fees.
Charlie
I agree with you about using the public waters as a commercial event.
Look at the zoo recently on Kentucky Lake during the B.A.S.S. tournament. 150 boats, plus on Saturday and Sunday hundreds of boats from local tournaments, somebody was making a lot of money for sure.
Is Monroe run by the Corp of Engineers? DNR does the fish management but they can't control the US GOVERMENT operations. State's manage their wildlife as best they can. But they can't help it if the **** Feds screwed up the spawn by lowing the lake levels at the wrong time. The Corps are there for flood control not to manage fish. I guess people and preventing floods still comes first with the Fed Govt.
Regards,
Moose1am
I think that the Indiana DNR does a great job. It not the biologist's fault that the Governor of IN take the funds generated by the DNR here in IN and spends it elsewhere and not on fishing or hunting related activities.
I have been told by people who work for DNR that this is happening. DNR could fund itself and be more self supporting if they were not being bleed to death by the politicians.
I am surprised that the State has not Sold Patoka to a private individual already.
Regards,
Moose1am
The IDNR Biologist don't just work at the lake when you fish them. They get there late and stay there until Midnight sometimes conducting their fish surveys in early April. I know because I have watched them work the surveys. Lots of work gets done that we don't see or learn about. But you can be sure that changing fish populations create the need for better surveys and news regulations. That requires some research out in the field to determine the fish population dynamics. When lakes get pressured and fish populations plummet the IDNR fishery Biologist gets an ear full. It's up to them to determine what each lake can sustain in fish population and what the regulations should be to try to please ALL the fisher persons. They do a lot of hard work and they get very little pay for what they do. Try to make a living off the State of IN at the DNR and you will figure out that it's not the best paying jobs in America.
Unless you can walk a mile in their shoes and know all the facts then it's sort of hard to really judge their effectiveness.
Lets face it guys. Indiana is an INDUSTRIAL state not a state that depends out of state tourists to finance our outdoor recreational facilities. Now KY is much more progressive when it comes to protecting their outdoor recreational activities. Patoka and Monroe combined don't compare to one KY lake in size or in revenue generated for a state.
Regards,
Moose1am
[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Jun-26-06 AT 07:47PM (EST)[/font][p]How are the fees that they are talking about a small price? The fees per fisherman are very small, but the fees that they are talking about charging the organization are rediculous. I suppose you would vote for a tax increase as well? The ramp is paid for by my launching permit every year, the fish that I release by my fishing license, and the water that I use by my Indiana state taxes. You want to pay more? Send them a check with a big thanks from the rest of us!
Also, What tourney organization do you fish with Crappie? I fish with several and I can tell you that myself and most of the other I fish with need food, drinks, and GAS when going to or leaving the lake. We have also used lodging at many of the lakes in Indiana. What memo did you get that told you that 99% do not help the economy?
As for "public funded", I contribute, you contribute, and so does every other member of our state that does not even visit the lake. Taxes fund most of these fisheries.
Hi Charlie. I do understand your question, although I may disagree with the premise. To understand my position on this you need to understand that our permit is something a tournament organizer obtains, not the individual angler.
What the organizer gets for the extra fee is some protection from other organizers stomping on his tournament. The fee is $100 per event, and we only permit one event per day. Each day there is a permitted event, we make sure we have personnel on duty to try to monitor illegal tournament activity. That will always consist of a gate attendant and a Ranger. Sometimes we catch them before they get started, and sometimes we respond to complaints from the permitted event. The organizers that book these tournaments are mostly happy with that return.
The extra money is pretty much consumed in labor costs and processing. Any little left over would take about 200 years to pay for a new ramp.
I still have the old pontoon boat and if you want to get some guys together and build a release boat, lets get together and talk.
>[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Jun-26-06
>AT 07:47*PM (EST)[/font]
>
>How are the fees that they
>are talking about a small
>price? The fees per
>fisherman are very small, but
>the fees that they are
>talking about charging the organization
>are rediculous. I suppose
>you would vote for a
>tax increase as well?
>The ramp is paid for
>by my launching permit every
>year, the fish that I
>release by my fishing license,
>and the water that I
>use by my Indiana state
>taxes. You want to
>pay more? Send them
>a check with a big
>thanks from the rest of
>us!
>
>Also, What tourney organization do you
>fish with Crappie? I
>fish with several and I
>can tell you that myself
>and most of the other
>I fish with need food,
>drinks, and GAS when going
>to or leaving the lake.
> We have also used
>lodging at many of the
>lakes in Indiana. What
>memo did you get that
>told you that 99% do
>not help the economy?
>
>As for "public funded", I contribute,
>you contribute, and so does
>every other member of our
>state that does not even
>visit the lake. Taxes
>fund most of these fisheries.
>
The 99% number was exagerated, however, I will still say a majority do not contribute to the local economies. As stated before most people fill up their gas tanks in their hometown before going to the lake. A serious tourny angler does not stop to pick up lures on the way, they have this stuff prepared well in advance. The hotels/motels won't see an impact, if it is near a lake they will be full regardless.
No matter what anybody says the tournies do have payouts, so people are profiting. The lake is owned by all of us, so you are using my property to make a buck, so I think the fees are a good thing to an extent, either set aside an organization only fee, or a per boat fee, but earmark the money for DNR only use, not this general fund #####. Your arguement about the ramp being paid for already by your other fees, well I could say the road to your driveway is paid for by my taxes too, so I can drive on over and set up a yard sale on your property to make a few dollars.
When you break it down the fees will only add about $5 per person, which isn't much. If it is alot and money is tight, then one might reconsider fishing the tournies, afterall it is a form of gambling, why gamble if money is tight?
Pay the small fees, forget about it, and go fishing.
Mike,
I sent you an email.
Charlie
Your argument about the road to my house is an invalid point. We use the ramps that are paid for by the state so if you want to use the roads that come to my house that are paid for by the state then feel free to come set up a yard sale on the road in front of my house.
The $5 is not a big deal but on top of all the other fees that anglers are being forced to pay to use the same waters that other fishermen and pleasure boaters are using is excessive and almost discrimination. The biggest problem we all see is there is not any improvements being done or nothing added to benefit the recreational or tournament fishing. I can compare to other states but if their concerned about tournaments and released fish why not provide a release boat like other states do. All you have to do is make a phone call in other states and they'll either have a release boat or a release truck their for your use.
Charlie