"duck dynasty" star fired for anti-gay beliefs

My opinion on all the matters discussed here are just that mine. Not looking to stir up or cause anyone to have hard feelings. But I must say that this thread if nothing else has accomplished (again my opinion) one great thing. That is an open discussion of why we have the holiday Christmas. If not for the birth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ none of us would have a tree, lights or time off for those lucky enough to share with family. My reason for butting in this thread is simply to say that I hope from this all of us take a little time to examine our beliefs, study them with scripture, and make peace within our hearts with God. I firmly trust the scriptures where they say that each will be judged on his/her faith in Christ. I also subscribe to the fact that none of us are just enough without His grace being applied through this faith.


Whether you feel Phil's or any others comments were appropriate or not will not matter when we all are face to face with our creator on that final day. The only thing that will matter then will whether or not you have accepted Christ into your life as you personal Lord and Savior.


Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.

[QUOTE=cburton;525878]My opinion on all the matters discussed here are just that mine. Not looking to stir up or cause anyone to have hard feelings. But I must say that this thread if nothing else has accomplished (again my opinion) one great thing. That is an open discussion of why we have the holiday Christmas. If not for the birth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ none of us would have a tree, lights or time off for those lucky enough to share with family. My reason for butting in this thread is simply to say that I hope from this all of us take a little time to examine our beliefs, study them with scripture, and make peace within our hearts with God. I firmly trust the scriptures where they say that each will be judged on his/her faith in Christ. I also subscribe to the fact that none of us are just enough without His grace being applied through this faith.


Whether you feel Phil's or any others comments were appropriate or not will not matter when we all are face to face with our creator on that final day. The only thing that will matter then will whether or not you have accepted Christ into your life as you personal Lord and Savior.


Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.[/QUOTE]

Wow are you a Minister if not you have missed your calling this is beautifully stated in my opinion.

[QUOTE=mhall;525885]Wow are you a Minister if not you have missed your calling this is beautifully stated in my opinion.[/QUOTE]

No sir I am more along the lines of the prodigal son. My brother is the minister.

Thanks for the kind words and have Merry Christmas

[QUOTE=cburton;525887]No sir I am more along the lines of the prodigal son. My brother is the minister.

Thanks for the kind words and have Merry Christmas[/QUOTE]

You do the same Mr Burton and thank you.

[QUOTE=apb;525874]SLP and jcb, appreciate the explanations and link.

I'll admit that I share Hlleonard's thoughts on much of this. Too much wiggle room for things, and too many people quoting the same verses, but assigning different meanings (not on this forum, in general). Big part of the problem that I had years ago when I was a believer: ask for clarification concerning parts of the bible that seemed in contradiction, and how do we know which one is right, and either get told to shut up, not too question, or get a non-answer all too often. May be its the scientist in me: my level of belief in something is equal to the amount of solid evidence for something.

geo:
Not sure that it is trying to poke holes because it does not fit our belief. It is more the case of trying to learn something. I have had a number of conversations with people on beliefs (I question them, they question me). I respect their beliefs even if I do not share them and the reverse is true. Its a way for both to learn something new or at least come to an understanding of how someone else sees something. I'm not one to try and force my beliefs on someone else: my beliefs may be wrong. Likewise, I do not allow others to force their beliefs on me. Plenty of religions in the world, they cannot all be right.

Regarding homosexuality as "wrong". I don't think we can claim it wrong or right, it just is. Same for heterosexuality. Claiming someone is wrong (or a sinner) because they are homosexual is akin to saying someone is wrong because they are blood type O, or have brown hair, or blue eyes, or brown skin, etc. You are born that way, it is not a choice and not something that you can change. For those who think it is a choice, try living as a homosexual for a month and let us know how easy it is. Also consider that there are documented cases of same sex coupling in over 100 different animal species. Its just part of nature. Why, no idea![/QUOTE]

Two things, apb:

On questioning Scripture - I agree with what you're saying about questions being brushed aside. But I've been a believer for 12 years now and I've seen attitudes change in the churches I know. Pastors and teachers I know are willing to accept questions and give straight answers. Many churches, in fact, purposely seek out those who are not Christian but just seeking answers.

On "born that way" - equating homosexuality with skin color or blood type is quite a stretch. Skin color is a condition based on the amount of melanin. Homosexuality, however, is a behavior. A man can state on Tuesday he is gay, and state on Wednesday he is straight, and he has thus miraculously changed his "sexual orientation". Can a white man decide one day he prefers dark skin, and change? But even to grant your point for the sake of discussion: same-gender attraction is simply another form of lust. Talk to criminologists, they will tell you about "born criminals" or "born thieves". The core message of Christianity is that we are *all* born with a predisposition to sin. That's why we need a Savior.

[QUOTE=cburton;525878]My opinion on all the matters discussed here are just that mine. Not looking to stir up or cause anyone to have hard feelings. But I must say that this thread if nothing else has accomplished (again my opinion) one great thing. That is an open discussion of why we have the holiday Christmas. If not for the birth of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ none of us would have a tree, lights or time off for those lucky enough to share with family. My reason for butting in this thread is simply to say that I hope from this all of us take a little time to examine our beliefs, study them with scripture, and make peace within our hearts with God. I firmly trust the scriptures where they say that each will be judged on his/her faith in Christ. I also subscribe to the fact that none of us are just enough without His grace being applied through this faith.


Whether you feel Phil's or any others comments were appropriate or not will not matter when we all are face to face with our creator on that final day. The only thing that will matter then will whether or not you have accepted Christ into your life as you personal Lord and Savior.


Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.[/QUOTE]

I too am glad for the civilized discussion on both sides. This same debate is going on at another site I frequent and has also resulted in some great discussion/debate.

It seems like the whole nation is having a philosophical debate about beliefs, religion, etc. You can't say this whole mess hasn't at least provoked a lot of conversation.

It's almost like the ole bearded redneck (who is a PHD I believe) was hoping that might happen. :cool:

[QUOTE=jcb;525907]... equating homosexuality with skin color or blood type is quite a stretch. Skin color is a condition based on the amount of melanin. Homosexuality, however, is a behavior. A man can state on Tuesday he is gay, and state on Wednesday he is straight, and he has thus miraculously changed his "sexual orientation". ....[/QUOTE]

So you personally could suddenly decide that you wanted to date the same sex? Really? I know there is no way that I could date a guy. Just the thought of it repulses me. Homosexuals who I have had this discussion with say the same thing about dating the opposite sex: it repulses them. Also, do you really think that people would chose to be alienated/discriminated againt by large parts of society, by families, etc. Sure, a few might, but larger numbers, doubtful.

I do agree that attitudes of churches change. In addition, different churches have different views. Some are much more open to discussion, while others are much more closed off. Did not mean to imply that all were closed off.

[QUOTE=apb;525920]So you personally could suddenly decide that you wanted to date the same sex? Really? I know there is no way that I could date a guy. Just the thought of it repulses me. Homosexuals who I have had this discussion with say the same thing about dating the opposite sex: it repulses them. Also, do you really think that people would chose to be alienated/discriminated againt by large parts of society, by families, etc. Sure, a few might, but larger numbers, doubtful.

I do agree that attitudes of churches change. In addition, different churches have different views. Some are much more open to discussion, while others are much more closed off. Did not mean to imply that all were closed off.[/QUOTE]

No, I'm not saying I could. I was trying to point out the problems involved in determining the rights, legal, moral and otherwise, for a behavior that can be nullified based only on a person's stated "feelings". As opposed to immutable conditions like skin color and blood type.

[QUOTE=apb;525920]So you personally could suddenly decide that you wanted to date the same sex? Really? I know there is no way that I could date a guy. Just the thought of it repulses me. [/QUOTE]

I believe there are folks who call themselves bi-curious who look into a homo-erotic experience to "see". If you don't call this "TESTING the field " of being gay I don't know what is.

It is mostly a thing with lesbians, but the black community also sees it.

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Down-low_(sexual_slang)[/url]

[url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bi-curious[/url]

What about in Prison. A hetero dude decides he wants to hump his cellmate is clearly not gay or homo but makes a decision to get his rocks off by performing a homo act.

It is getting deep here, BUT how do you explain that away. It is clearly a DECISION.

Now, I don't think it is always a decision, but there are cases where people decide to become gay, or act gay.

Later,

Geo

[QUOTE=MrSplitshot;525918]It seems like the whole nation is having a philosophical debate about beliefs, religion, etc. You can't say this whole mess hasn't at least provoked a lot of conversation.

It's almost like the ole bearded redneck (who is a PHD I believe) was hoping that might happen. :cool:[/QUOTE]

He's probably could have earned a PhD if he didn't like duck hunting so much. He he. But he does have his BS in Physical Education from Louisiana Tech and he has his Masters degree in Education. He was a school teacher for a while.

[QUOTE=GeoFisher;525926]I believe there are folks who call themselves bi-curious who look into a homo-erotic experience to "see". If you don't call this "TESTING the field " of being gay I don't know what is.

It is mostly a thing with lesbians, but the black community also sees it.

[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Down-low_(sexual_slang)[/URL]

[URL]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bi-curious[/URL]

What about in Prison. A hetero dude decides he wants to hump his cellmate is clearly not gay or homo but makes a decision to get his rocks off by performing a homo act.

It is getting deep here, BUT how do you explain that away. It is clearly a DECISION.

Now, I don't think it is always a decision, but there are cases where people decide to become gay, or act gay.

Later,

Geo[/QUOTE]

Good point on the prison stuff. Yes, you might have an example of a decision in that case. Not sure if that is just about sex though. That may be one example of a decision, but I think you'll find that for the most part, it is not a decision, it is how people are wired.

As with other aspects of humans, there is a good deal of variation between different people in sexual orientation. Some are straight and some are gay with absolutely no desire to be different. Others, prefer heterosexual, but will do homosexual, others prefer homosexual, but will do heterosexual. Same with many other aspects of sexual preferences whether it be a preference for certain body parts, hair color, sexual positions, slut vs. very modest, etc.