A question of values.......

So we've had discussions here before about how or value system is going to crap.

Lots of folks here post that it is Christian values and Christian morality that is missing. I personally believe that.

Other, non Christians post here that THAT has nothing to do with it.

Atheists here.....and there are some Atheists and Agnostics here.....post that Christ doesn't exist, Hell doesn't exist....bla, bla, bla.....and that they have all the values and morality to "do the right" thing.......whatever.

My question is this..........those that think Christian or Religious values have NOTHING to do with right and wrong......how were you raised. Were you raised with religion as a child? The reason I ask is this........I know a ton of folks who don't believe in Christ, say they never have, yet they were raised in CHRISTIAN HOMES with a value system that teaches morality, values, etc, etc. NOT that you cannot teach those things without Christ.

I do wonder how many folks who spout about NOT needing Christ to lead a moral and ethical life actually were raised without an OUNCE of Christ??

Tell the truth.

Later,

Geo

I should say........I believe in Christ, but is has been an interesting path...but I don't regularly attend a church. I am getting closer though.

I was raised Mormon up until I was smart enough to "question" what they were teaching...about the 7-8th grade. It was an interesting awakening. I remember to this day my social studies teacher asking the class if anyone was Mormon. Since I was really, REALLY shy back then, I didn't raise my hand. He then went on for an hour about the "lies" about Mormonism. Of course he was a "strong Methodist Christian". A few days later, I told him that I was Mormon......he of course back peddled quite a bit, but the truth had been told. I still spent time in the Mormon church for a couple more years, but by the time I was really ready for HS school, I had completely became ANTI MORMON....It took me 20 years or so to find the right group of folks to help me start believing again.

My point is this.....even though I was away from a Religious value system for 20 years, the first 10 or 15 of my years were FILLED with a morals, ethics, and values directly associated with religious beliefs.

Later,

Geo

Was raised from two people that had STRONG faith and was taught with my brothers and sister to be the same way. I was the youngest of four and was an Oops baby. My parents were older and old school to the core. My Dad was a Sea Bee in WWII, my mother was a Labratory technician at Central State Hospital for 30 years before retiring.
Dad was a welder by trade and also retired after 24 years at Pohl Iron works. I tell you that to give you some scale as to how I was raised and to answer your question.

I was taught nothing absolutely nothing is free and easy, you work for it. You treat people the way you want to be treated and be NICE. I still to this very day open doors for women and say Yes Mam and No Sir...all the time. It's a habit I'm proud of. Amongst many other CHRISTIAN BASED values they instilled, I believe this was the basic moral foundation in which they tried to lay for us. When we did something wrong we got in trouble to, big time. My Dad couldn't stand people that were bums and take hand outs, I saw him work three jobs at a time when I was very young, and he didn't complain.

Jesus works people, believe it in your heart always, basic moral values and good common sense ethical ways of life are the way to go.

I will say this as a caviat. There is a person on this site that will remain nameless that is unsure about the after life, the possibilty of there being a God and heavan ect. With that said I will also say that he is one of the kindest most thoughful and generous person I have ever met in my life. He would give you the shirt off of his back and would always try to do the right thing. Had to add that in there.

I was raised with a little bit of Catholic School for a few years spent summers in Georgia attending a Southern Baptist Church and my mom is a practicing Budhist. I became a Christian years ago. Dad was a 30 Navy man, I had two years of ROTC and I served 4 years in the Army so I also had that kind of discipline.
No matter where I was at in my life I always had the same basic teachings of values and being considerate of others. Most people I associate with think the same way as I do about what's right and wrong.
As far as saying I had Christ in my life...that would be once I asked for Jesus to be in my heart. Once I accepted that I changed. I didn't become above others or better or perfect I just admitted I can't do it alone and that I'm gonna need some help and guidance. Sure I'm gonna sin and screw up but he knows that..... That's part of the deal.

Nicely put Don...

To be clear........I'm not saying that those with no Religious background have no morals or values......Rather, I'm wondering how/where they came from. I'm assuming that people get moral and values from being taught those traits.........Who taught them, and how does that apply to them passing on those traits.

Seems to be basic common values and morality are sorely missing from my generation and and my kids generation.......NOT implying that my kids don't have morals and values because THEY DO.

Later,

Geo

Are we having ourselves a confession here? lol

Raised up as Methodist, mostly by my mom...Dad never went to church much, not until after I left home anyway. I still belong to a Methodist church today although I don't attend.

First thing....I guess for me is do the best I can, try to live right (some may question what right is)...and like Don said, I have screwed up before...but hopefully I won't ever screw up in the future as much as I have done in the past.

Second thing....I would rather live my life believing there is a God and a heaven and then when I die find out there's not, rather than live my life as if God doesn't exist and then when I die find out that he does (oops!!).

Third thing...what is the root of all evil...is it money or is it women, cause I like both! LOL....Ok....that's a joke (sort of).

Bottom line...there ain't a one of us that ain't a sinner...all we can do is try our best and keep God in our hearts and minds everyday in all of our actions.

[QUOTE=GeoFisher;462640]
I do wonder how many folks who spout about NOT needing Christ to lead a moral and ethical life actually were raised without an OUNCE of Christ??

Tell the truth.

Later,

Geo[/QUOTE]

I've never spouted about NOT needing Christ but at the same time not real sure where I fit in and never have been. I can count on hands and toes the number of times I have went to church - my parents never pushed it. With that said I can say I lead a pretty moral and ethical life with less than an ounce of Christ.

My view is this - do the best you can, try to always do what's right, and if you can do that the rest will fall into place

My wife is Catholic. Just tossing that in - she has been taking the kids to church school but I don't plan on trying to push anything on them except for the views stated in the paragraph above this one.

Proverbs 22:6 says, "Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it."

In our youth we may stray from what we were taught but, as we become older and wiser, we remember what we learned as children. Those values become 'valuables' and the roadmap for our lives in most cases. There are some exceptions and certain people, for reasons that I cannot understand, try to distance themselves from the good solid foundation their parents gave them for their lives. While they may try and forget their raising, they still remember what they were taught; it's forever planted in their memory and from time to time they do revisit those memories.

I was raised in a strict Christian (Protestant) home and attended church three times a week. I have always believed in God The Almighty and His Son, Jesus Christ. While in high school I had a friend who attended the same church as me and was a devout Christian. She was a math whiz and won a full ride college scholarship. The higher she went in college and the more degrees she earned, the less she wanted to do with God or religion; she even began to deny there was a God. Then when she was hired as a NASA scientist she decided she knew more than believers and was certain that the God she served all those years no longer existed. She wrote to our pastor and asked him to remove her name from the church membership records and to destroy all records that proved she had ever attended that church.

Both of my parents are now deceased but I still remember the good values they taught me. After all these years, I would still love to go fishing, just Dad and me, and talk about things and get advice that only a loving Dad can give his daughter.

It scares me to think how my life may have turned out if I didn't have such deep faith in God.

Before I answer about how I was raised, I feel like I should clarify about my beliefs, which is hard for me to do. As a young man, I had myself convinced I was an atheist, but looking back I think that was more just rebellion against organized religion, which I threw in with the rest of the "establishment." I too was an "oops baby," my two brothers are 8 and 10 years older than me, and I tended to try and emulate them, except I took it to the nth degree - they got their rebellion out of the way during their teens, whereas mine continued well into my 20's. But later on in life I've come to realize that the atheists are doing exactly the same thing - claiming to know the absolute truth about something that is unknowable. And that is at the crux of what I believe today. The entity that we call God is something way more mystical and fantastic than we on Earth have the power to understand, and it is the ultimate conceit to tell someone that they have to believe the same as you do or they're going to Hell.

OK I was about to go on and on about my beliefs, but that's not what you asked. Just understand that I have given this a good deal of thought, and continue to do so today. When I was growing up, we went to a Methodist church on Sunday, but we really didn't discuss religion all that much at home. I do remember one of my brothers cussing and being told, "You will not take the Lord's name in vain in this house!", but we didn't sit down and discuss the Bible or anything like that. But there was a Christian summer camp that we all went to for a week or two every year, and I have some great memories from there. Looking back now, I have to think my parents chose the Methodist church out of convenience more than ideology. My father came from a long line of Seventh Day Baptists in Wisconsin (Pardon Davis was my 3rd cousin, 3 times removed: [URL]http://www.wlhn.org/wnf/stories/pardondavis.htm[/URL]) and while I've never asked, I would assume my mother was raised Catholic, since her mom was French Canadian and her dad was Dutch.

So I guess the short answer would be that I am one of the people you're talking about, in that I was raised by Christians, but I don't believe you have to be a Christian to be a good person. And I suppose you think this proves something or other, I'm not sure what. I would just like to point out one thing: Only 30% of the nearly 7 billion people on this planet adhere to the Christian faith. Of the remaining 70%, I daresay there are quite literally BILLIONS of people who lead extremely moral and ethical lives, without, as you put it, an OUNCE of Christ.

[QUOTE=psprowler;462660]I've never spouted about NOT needing Christ but at the same time not real sure where I fit in and never have been. I can count on hands and toes the number of times I have went to church - my parents never pushed it. With that said I can say I lead a pretty moral and ethical life with less than an ounce of Christ.

My view is this - do the best you can, try to always do what's right, and if you can do that the rest will fall into place

My wife is Catholic. Just tossing that in - she has been taking the kids to church school but I don't plan on trying to push anything on them except for the views stated in the paragraph above this one.[/QUOTE]

That's completely fair...........I posed this question because I have a lot of friends who say they're not Christians and that they don't "need" it..fair enough. But they were raised with morals and values seeped in Religion. So even though they are not "Christians" their value system is Christian based.

I guess what I'm trying to find is folks that were raised heathens, by heathens :) :) have have a correct moral compass. I'm of course kind of joking here, but I wonder REALLY how much influence Christian values have on non Christian practicing folks......

Later,

Geo

Raised a catholic, my wife went through 13 yrs of parocial education, my childre spent their primary years in a catholic school.I was raised to be tolerant, follow the golden rule, thats probably why I'm considered a liberal. BUT I also know that religion is ma good hiding place for scondrels.I believe that we have freedom from religion. I dont want God in politics, but I do want the values that go with it. As far as the bible goes, it was for the jews as well as the gentiles, a lot of folks seem to forget that.If you want to follow the teaching of Jesus, his words are there, The sermon on the mount summed up what He expected of us.And though at times I tried I'm also a sinner.