Should Trump Be Involved In The NFL Anthem Controversy

[sweetwater]

The players do not receive the manual; policies in the manual are enforced by the teams. And the language about the anthem has not changed since 1978.

The language in the manual is as follows: “The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem. During the playing of the National Anthem, players on the field should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. Players in the bench areas should do the same, and should line themselves up evenly along the sidelines. The home team should insure that the American Flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses.”

[SLP]

The players do not receive the manual; policies in the manual are enforced by the teams. And the language about the anthem has not changed since 1978.

The language in the manual is as follows: “The National Anthem must be played prior to every NFL game, and all players must be on the sideline for the National Anthem. During the playing of the National Anthem, players on the field should stand at attention, face the flag, hold helmets in their left hand, and refrain from talking. Players in the bench areas should do the same, and should line themselves up evenly along the sidelines. The home team should insure that the American Flag is in good condition. It should be pointed out to players and coaches that we continue to be judged by the public in this area of respect for the flag and our country. Failure to be on the field by the start of the National Anthem may result in discipline, such as fines, suspensions, and/or the forfeiture of draft choice(s) for violations of the above, including first offenses.”

No argument that IMO they should stand and that the NFL has botched this but that has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation about how Trump has handled it. He has handled it poorly and has escalated the entire situation, but who knows maybe that's what he was after?

On a side note, I remember it wasn't all too many years ago that the NFL didn't even require players to be on the field during the anthem, maybe within the last ten years they added the rule. I remember going to games and they often would be out for warm ups, then go back inside and not return to the field until after the anthem was finished.

[sweetwater]

No argument that IMO they should stand and that the NFL has botched this but that has absolutely nothing to do with the conversation about how Trump has handled it. He has handled it poorly and has escalated the entire situation, but who knows maybe that's what he was after?

On a side note, I remember it wasn't all too many years ago that the NFL didn't even require players to be on the field during the anthem, maybe within the last ten years they added the rule. I remember going to games and they often would be out for warm ups, then go back inside and not return to the field until after the anthem was finished.

Mmm, notice the manual says "should stand" not shall stand. Besides the teams and the NFL are scared of the players so they're not going to enforce the rules anyway. Back on subject now. By taking the extra step of calling for players to be fired Trump stoked an outrage from all the people he intended to inflame, a strategy of his that has worked time and again. He wants his liberal enemies in politics and the media to take the bait on these cultural wars and they usually and stupidly oblige. These battles illustrate why the Democratic Party has lost favor among voters in rural and small-town America. People don't take kindly to not standing for the National Anthem in all the places Trump and the Republicans need to win in 2018 and 2020. Trump couldn't care less if people in urban areas, where Republicans have no hope of competing anyway, are upset with his colorfully communicated views. Like a political magician with an endless bag of tricks Trump turned Democrats into the urban elite, anti-working man party in 2016. In 2017 he has turned them into the anti-American flag (and anthem) party.

[SLP]

Well now you are making a completely different point than the one you made in your opening post. I have already said I felt he probably did it on purpose to incite a reactions, no argument from me there. He likley also thought it a bonus to stick it to the NFL who he has had past issues with.

If you respect him for how he conducted himself, escalating the situation, purposely dividing people, and politicizing the flag and the anthem that's your prerogative. Personally I don't care for it. and IMO it demeans the office. I don't like it when democrats do it, and I don't like it when republicans do it either. I don't excuse it just because I may favor one party over the other. That's half the problem in this country, too many people excuse bad behaviour when it comes from "their" party.

This will likely be my last post on this thread. I generally stay away from the political threads anymore because they usually end up just going in circles with little real discussion and nothing accomplished. I'm a big football fan, have been for over fifty years so I had an interest in this discussion but now it has just started to run it's course and is turning into the same old democrats vs republican arguments which never go anywhere in these threads.

[sweetwater]

Well now you are making a completely different point than the one you made in your opening post. I have already said I felt he probably did it on purpose to incite a reactions, no argument from me there. He likley also thought it a bonus to stick it to the NFL who he has had past issues with.

If you respect him for how he conducted himself, escalating the situation, purposely dividing people, and politicizing the flag and the anthem that's your prerogative. Personally I don't care for it. and IMO it demeans the office. I don't like it when democrats do it, and I don't like it when republicans do it either. I don't excuse it just because I may favor one party over the other. That's half the problem in this country, too many people excuse bad behaviour when it comes from "their" party.

This will likely be my last post on this thread. I generally stay away from the political threads anymore because they usually end up just going in circles with little real discussion and nothing accomplished. I'm a big football fan, have been for over fifty years so I had an interest in this discussion but now it has just started to run it's course and is turning into the same old democrats vs republican arguments which never go anywhere in these threads.

To make the road to nowhere just a bit brighter the NFL well knew what the kneeling protest was about before Trump got involved. It was a claim that police were hunting down black men and other people of color. Colin Kaepernick could not have been clearer about that. That same year after five Dallas cops were slain by a sniper the Dallas Cowboys requested permission to wear small Arm in Arm decals on their helmets in honor of police killed while serving and protecting their community. The NFL said no, that message would not be permitted so if we’re going to make a list of people who made this controversy worse there will be a lot of names on it before Donald Trump’s.

[SLP]

LOL, I'm the one who has been blaming the NFL since the second post in this thread (my first post) so I'm not sure what your point is?

I hate how these players are politicizing the game and think the NFL and it's owners have handled it horribly by not requiring their "employees" who represent them to conduct themselves to a higher standard. Worse yet then doubled down be going as far as supporting them...

But again the real issue I have is with the NFL and it's owners. They could have handled this much better and now it has just snowballed as a result of they not not doing so.

And really with all due respect and no offense intended, I'm having hard time following your points. Feels like herding cats .

Your opening post to begin the thread asked the question. "Should Trump Be Involved In The NFL Anthem Controversy"?

You answered your own question with a yes, and gave the reasons why: "defend the flag, anthem, moral reason, etc. Then later you shifted completely to he intentionally and strategically "stoked" and 'inflamed' people as part of his "bag of tricks" to beat democrats. All of which seems like it would be the antithesis to the reasons in your opening post.

Now in your last response you again shift the topic of discussion, this time away from Trumps involvement that you originally asked for opinions about to the NFL's handling of it. I doubt anyone disagrees with the notion that the NFL have botched. No argument there.

As I said before I probably will bow out of the discussion now. I only answered this because you directed it at me and quoted me when you replied and I couldn't understand how it related to my point or the discussion about Trumps involvement.

Again no disrespect intended just having a hard time following you. Have a nice evening.

[kygorski]

They can stand on their heads for all it matters. What matters is the NFL pays little tax, allows too may commercials. And limits its free viewing.The game has becoming boring! Why spend almost 4 hours watching an actual hour of sport?I never understood soccer, but tomwatch a game for almost 15 minutes with out a commercial is drawnig me toward it moreTrumpilthinskin is blowing smke up our butts again because he has almost accomplished NOTHING

[sweetwater]

LOL, I'm the one who has been blaming the NFL since the second post in this thread (my first post) so I'm not sure what your point is?





And really with all due respect and no offense intended, I'm having hard time following your points. Feels like herding cats .

Your opening post to begin the thread asked the question. "Should Trump Be Involved In The NFL Anthem Controversy"?

You answered your own question with a yes, and gave the reasons why: "defend the flag, anthem, moral reason, etc. Then later you shifted completely to he intentionally and strategically "stoked" and 'inflamed' people as part of his "bag of tricks" to beat democrats. All of which seems like it would be the antithesis to the reasons in your opening post.

Now in your last response you again shift the topic of discussion, this time away from Trumps involvement that you originally asked for opinions about to the NFL's handling of it. I doubt anyone disagrees with the notion that the NFL have botched. No argument there.

As I said before I probably will bow out of the discussion now. I only answered this because you directed it at me and quoted me when you replied and I couldn't understand how it related to my point or the discussion about Trumps involvement.

Again no disrespect intended just having a hard time following you. Have a nice evening.

If you can't follow it then stop commenting. You've been taking a response to you own comments and twisting it around then you complain about it. If that's not the case then I'm sorry you didn't comprehend the narrative.

[SLP]

If you can't follow it then stop commenting. You've been taking a response to you own comments and twisting it around then you complain about it. If that's not the case then I'm sorry you didn't comprehend the narrative.

LOL, oh I comprehend it just fine. My use of you being hard to follow was just my attempting at being polite. To be more blunt you started a thread with a very specific assertion and when those responding took exception or disagreed with your point of view you just kept shifting to a different argument instead of defending it.