Carp in WEST BOGGS

[panfish]

Mike,

Have there been any discussing lately about adding predator fish like stripers or wipers? They seems to be catching more and more attention on the major resorivors around the state. I have a big wiper on the wall that I caught at Boggs before the lake was drained. It was only 3/4 of a lb off the state record at the time. Are there any argument against putting them in?

[MikeAxsom]

[font size="1" color="#FF0000"]LAST EDITED ON Apr-25-06 AT 05:57PM (EST)[/font][p]Panfish

My understanding of the fisheries management folks’ position on that issue is that an additional predator might be introduced at some later point. The current rapid growth rate of Largemouth Bass and the excellent fishing opportunities that is presenting, are likely to go into decline at some point due to the Shad population. The same Shad that are providing the food source to fuel the Bass growth rate are also competing with the juvenile Bass for resources farther down the food chain. As the older Bass die or are harvested, and are not replaced by young Bass, the great Bass fishing will slow drastically.

As long as the Bass are making good use of the Shad for recreational fishing, it is not seen as desirable to introduce another predator to compete directly with them. Later, when the Bass fishery plunges, another predator might be brought in the make some additional use of the shad and thereby provide another fishing opportunity. This would probably be a temporary situation as well, as at some point the lake would need to undergo a complete renovation again; if and when funds are available for that.

The new presence of Carp in this mix may alter the timelines for all these factors, but will probably not change the final outcome.

[panfish]

Mike,

I am not a biologist, but have tried to educate myself about stripers.

It is inaccurate to say that stripers would compete with the black bass currently in the lake.

Stripers are an open water fish and feed almost exclusively on shad. It amazes me how you can troll shiners in front of stripers for hours and catch no fish and put a shad on and have a fish 15 minutes later. These fish are extremely selective on their diet.

I know it is a goal to control or reduce the shad poulation as much as possible. The striper would help do that. I think it would make more sense to add them now. It would allow another species for anglers and could postpone the need to drain the lake and start over. Every year you can maintain the current conditions, Westboggs can continue to attract anglers and continue to generate revenues. These revenues are going to be extremely important when it comes time to drain the lake again.

I don't think it makes sense to wait until the fishery is crashing to add predator fish.

[MikeAxsom]

Could be, but it really does no good to try to convince me. The IDNR biologists will be the folks to make those decisions. Not being a biologist myself, I really have to rely on them to provide the expertise for our fishery. And as long as they think putting in wipers needs to wait, wait is what we'll do.

[Moose1am]

I know that Dan Carnahan reads these forums. Inside joke here. Got a laugh out of him and his crew when I talked to them once and mentioned this web sites forums leaning to the right a wee bit. LOL

Anyway I know that they are trying to introduce hybrid stripers in Patoka Lake to help control the Gizzard shad population. Patoka is relatively shallow mostly but has some deep water in the old river channel and up around the **** area. Patoka is around 8800 acres at summer pool and is the second largest reservoirs in IN.

Mike: how big is West Bogs? Maybe it's too shallow or too small to support a hybrid striper population. These fish need lots of room to cruise the deep water edges hunting for their prey. They are said to be deep water fish and constantly on the move following the schools of shad.

I know that the Indiana DNR helps you manage the fish in your park's lake. I am surprised that Dan has not recommended that hybrid stripers be stocked in the lake. There may be other reasons why he has not recommended this.

He can recommend to do stuff in his reports but that does not mean that those things always get done as recommended. It's up to the DNR property managers to do this according to the fishery biologist's recommendations.
Regards,

Moose1am

[MikeAxsom]

Moose1am

Dan works from District 7’s office at Sugar Ridge. We are in District 6, which is headquartered out of the Avoca office. Dave Kittaka is our fisheries Biologist. I happen to know that most of the fisheries folks check the boards from time tot time to see what the buzz is, but they almost never post. It is just mostly not productive for them to get involved in the types of discussions that often go on in these venues; i.e., the import of alligators, or the merits of carp for controlling Zebra Mussels. I sometimes wish the IDNR would hire a person just to interact with the bait shop wannabes, and bait-bucket biologists, so that there was someone working to quell some of the misinformation that seems to runs in cycles. But the Biologists have too much to do to spend their time on that. Dave, for example, is responsible for all the fisheries work in 10 counties. That is impossible enough a task without getting bogged down in what someone thinks might be a good idea that they are just sure the professionals have not thought of yet.

As for the issue of putting wipers in West Boggs; if and when it fits into the district management plan, they can do OK here. As someone else already pointed out, they were introduced by IDNR here back in the 1980’s, and there were still good numbers of them when we did the 1994 renovation. I was impressed with the size and numbers of wipers I saw at that time.

I’m not sure about your point that the fisheries biologists only recommend things and that it is the property managers who are responsible for implementation of the fisheries management plans. As far as I know, all the fisheries management resources, including the hatchery stock, are utilized directly in fisheries plan work by the division of Fish and Wildlife. Property managers are mostly thrilled to have those experts and resources available, as most of us do not have that area of expertise ourselves. For me to introduce a new species of fish because some folks on a website thought it would be a good idea, would be the epitome of irresponsibility, and is also against the law.

[DSPCHAMY]

Muskie, Tiger Muskie & Northern Pike, there is your answer bring the Apex Predators in and that will clean up those large shad, and pretty much everything else. They could accidently get pumped out of the livewell one night. Any other takers????

[panfish]

Did you miss the comment that they did not want a species to compete with the bass?

On a side note, does anyone know if they are still raising tiger muskie at Glendale. I was down there years ago and they were raising them. I never heard what they planned to do with them.

[meathead]

hybrid stripers can survive and thrive in small ponds. They are popular pond aquaculture fish. They would do fine in boggs.

[panfish]

They were stocked in Boggs before it was drained. They did great then.

[Chigger_Brumbalow]

Alligator Mississippiensis, is the answer to the problem.

Alligators eat just about anything, including lizards, fish, snakes, turtles, small mammals, birds, crustaceans, and even small alligators.

Good tourist attraction too.