GAS, TRUCKS, AND BOATS AND SUCH

[HURRICANEBOB]

Have you noticed the relationship? Gas prices are steady on the rise while truck sales and prices keep tumbling. The Excursion from Ford is now a dinosaur. The truck manufacturers are all scurrying for better mile per gallon ratings. Chevy says its working on "displacment on demand" for its full sized V-8 trucks. Working on it? Well I'll be darned if Cadillac hasn't had that for the longest time already. They called their version the North Star. But Caddy and Chevy are both part of GM, so why do they tell us they are "working on it"? Simple, They have heard the market loud and clear, and the technology that's ben available for the longest time,with sales slumping and profits down, they now are willing to provide us. Actually, I think they got the word with gas so high. Consumers made it clear, either we get better mileage, or we don't buy, even at all time low prices.

Now lets just take that same logic and push it to boats. Lets say we all slowed the pace of boat buying. Maybe ya now buy a new ever 3 years. Maybe ya just decide to make that every 6 years, cause gas is high, and well all know boat motors get worse mileage then even the biggest gas hogging truck on the road. Ya think maybe the boat builders would suddenly start coming up with better technology? Better hull design aimed at efficiency, or even more emphasis on motor gas economy then Evenrude's E-tech, and the Honda 4's already muster? What about "displacement on demand" boat motor engines? What about hybrid boat motors? WOT, ya get 6 tubes burning mix. Half throttle, the motor drops out 3 jugs and runs on just 3, Cut it to no wake speed, and the gasser stops, and the electric motor kicks in. Hey, don't we call those trolling motors?

So just maybe, for us all to reap the techno benefits, we need to slow the boat and motor buys, force the builders to take notice, and just maybe while the technology was "being worked on" the prices would drop. Ya know, right now, ya can buy a Chevy, 2006 1/2 ton WT, full size pickup, for less than a small bass boat. Wasn't that way about 12 months ago. Just maybe its time for the boating industry to take a little more of the high gas price hit, translated to less sales, so they might have the incentive to go the way of the car builders. And ya know, we'd all have such a great rationale for doing it. "Well its like this Mister Boat Dealer, you haven't offered me much of any discount on this here $32,000 boat, motor, and trailer, and with gas so high, and my old truck not have the new "on demand-gas saving technology", I just can't afford to buy me that new boat. Besides, the motor##### so much gas I couldn't afford to run the boat with gas prices so high, and since you all made the hull so darn heavy, I can't afford the gas for the truck to even attempt pulling such a heavy load". So Mister Dealer, I know its not your fault, but until that there boat builder and motor builder make this thing lighter, make it get better mileage, and cut about $5000 back to me as a rebate, well I guess my old one will just have to do". How could they argue.......well, I mean with a clear conscience anyway.

Folks, no one make you pay high prices for cars, boats, or even gas. We, the buyer, make the decisions on what we buy, and how much. Consume a lot of gas, and we all pay more. Buy trucks, and we all pay more. And thats exactly what has gotten us all to the point where a bass boat can cost more than a new mobile home! Didn't used to be like that, and we can have it that way again!

[Danny]

Great post Bob.

Another thing that I've been harping on for years is the fossil fuel industry. They have such a large lobby that the US, under both democrat and republican leadership, has no real energy policy. If we, the U.S. were to turn private industry lose on the problem of alternative fuels, and offer sufficient incentive to come up with a way to power our vehicles just as well, I can almost guarantee you that we would have both automobiles and boats that run on something other than gasoline. We are fortunate to live in a country that has the freedoms we do, but we are almost as equally unfortunate that our politicians always come out of office as multi-millionairs. Wonder why? Lobbiests maybe?

Another thing I found very humerous. Last evening I saw a car commercial for a buick automobile. They were advertising that the car gets a whopping 29 miles per gallon on the highway, estimated of course. How many of you here are old enough to remember the gas crunch in the mid 70's when gas got as high as 79¢ a gallon? Well back then the cars got better gas milage than that. How much you want to bet the fossil fuel industry is also lining the automaker's pockets to keep fuel guzzeling motors in the market?

And yes, I do have a fuel guzzeling pickup truck that pulls my fuel guzzeling boat. But at least I do have an opti-max that uses far less fuel than what my Evenrude Intruder did.

Great topic for a thread.

Danny

[ranimated]

My brother is a chemistry major at WKU. He says that science has already found alternative ways of producing fuel. One example is a way that gasoline can be produced from methane, and how methane can be produced from common waste material. I'm not a scientist, but that's the jest of it. Anyone wanna guess who bought this idea from the scientist who conceived it? I bet the oil companies have a guarded, locked room full of ideas like these they've bought the rights to.
I totally agree though that the consumer drives the market. But the fuel industry knows that we have to buy, will buy, no matter what. Of course, I too drive a fuel guzzling truck and pull a fuel guzzling boat. Both of which I would not give up easily. Maybe if I, and people like me, were willing to sacrifice and stop buying or buy smaller then the message would get to the market. In my defense (and those like me) I dreamed a long time of having the things I have now and I worked hard to get them. I'm 38 and just now can afford these nice things. Isn't that part of the American dream? And by the way, even at my age, I can remember the 70's when there were many cars that got better gas mileage than the best mileage non-hybrids of today. If we could do that then, imagine what the automotive companies COULD do now. If we made them.

[GeoFisher]

Interesting thread.....

You'd be SURPRISED how much politics plays in the alternative fuel fight. Take for instance......the issue of ethanol, and the BEST method for producting it.

You have politicians from the CORN growing states pushing corn as the "biomass" of choice for creating ethanol, but from what I've read, CORN is about the worse thing you can grow. The amt of water, fertilizer, post production, etc....outweighs the final benefit. Not only that, but only about 10% of the harvested product can be used to produce ethanol.

The is a study from KY university.......YES......our STATE, about using Sawgrass. Sawgrass is perfect. It requires very limited cultivation, can be used to shore up wetlands, and help stem erosion, does not require TONS of fertilizer, and can be grown about anywhere. They even created a genetically altered version that can grow in the HARSH environments in some of our northern states. A few million acres of land could generate enough Renewable fuel for generations to come.

Interesting.....

Later,

Geo

[LarryG]

Hey about alternative fuels. We take some coins out of big oils pockets, and put them into corporate farmings pockets.Its a lose lose situation.When we use food grains for fuel, the cost of food goes up. Every one has their hand out for uncle sugar to help US, and we are us, and so we are screwing our selves. Its not only for burning in our vechicles. the petro chemical industry is also being squeezed by thease prices.How about a national speed limit of 60mph?. alternative quitting times for business to avoid traffic jams? These are only band aids on chest wounds. I didn't see much of a let down on recreational traffic last holiday, so the price is not hurting those who have the money. But when a guy with a low paying job, cant afford to get to work, and quits, maybe that will open some eyes. the trucks are still going 70+ miles per hour, and not very many of them are shutting down yet, but when fuel prices gouge into the profit, something else will need to suffer, like poor maintaence, and more dangerous under insured vechicles .Its a delima and the solutions are going to be very painfull.

[peter]

Back in the 70's my brother had designed a water wall for installation in a house.The wall was was passive solar energy collector and storage system.
No moving parts. Now the house was built with good insulation also. He built some of the houses in Virginia and documented all the data and the houses are still there today.

Now the place in VA where the houses are has the same sunlight (degree days) and temperature as Louisville, KY.
1250 sq ft, 3 bedroom ranch cost $75 per year to heat. Think what that would do to the coal industry, utility industry, and oil and natural gas industry if a lot of folks used it. If suddenly 20 percent of the house used it I guess the impact on large industries could throw us in a severe recession or worse.

Then ...Jimmy Carter lost the election and Reagan went the other direction My brother closed up shop the month after.
Yes politics touches everything and I mean everything. No one has figured out a way to own the sunlight. Maybe one day the Government will tax sunlight..not an absurd proposition when you think about what is taxed..property being one. It's all about the money and I guess there is nothing wrong with that.

There are ways to passively cool a house also.
A solar hot water heater is definately a no brainer.

All this not to be confused with solar cells.

Wow. maybe this post dies not belong here

[davidsa]

My take on a boat has always been that if I can't pay for it in cash that I can't afford it. I really enjoy my boat but for the 15 days a year it hits the water in no way can I justify massive payments. About 2 years ago, I was able to move to the same strategy on cars. When you write a check for $30K, it really hits home how much money it really is and makes one think twice about the purchase.

My take on boats, long drives pulling a boat and running and gunning in the boat is that without fuel or technology advancements none of this stuff may be practical for a average guy in say 5-10 years. For me just to pull my boat down to Barkley and back plus 3 days boat gas is $250 to $300 not including lodging or anything else. Basically, a 4 day fishing weekend now costs me $400 even if I split part of the costs and that does not include depreciation of boat, truck, repairs, nothing.

I am interested in a new rig but won't even consider a new outfit till it becomes clear where gas prices will net out.

[mkmsports41]

Here is an interesting read on Mercury and Ethenal Blended Fuels. http://bbcboards.zeroforum.com/zerothread?id=114216

[zx150]

I couldn't agree more. When you can finace a boat for longer than a house that is getting crazy.

[DJD]

Whats even more crazy is that some people fall for the option of long term financing. Not me, it's a choice i'm not willing to make. Great topic.

[basstrucker123]

i like your thinking bob ive been saying this same thing for yrs. it works basstrucker

[Dester]

Let's not forget that a gallon of milk is over $4.00 as well so we do need to keep of a mind that nothing is cheap but our salaries and retirement benefits just havent kept up. The root of it is too much government and too many taxes. They are squeezing us dry.