Fireline Crystal

[Moose1am]

Thanks Andrew.

Yes I think they see the lines ok but they are more interested in the baits and eating.

It's like when I am super hungry and someone puts a 12 oz steak on paper plate in front of me. I don't really care what type of plate the steak is served on as I am focused on the steak only.

Last night I went back to my College Ichthyology book to look up some information regarding the eyes of different fish. The book is by Karl F. Lagler, John E. Bardach and Robert R. Miller. All three were from the University of Michigan. Karl was the Professor of Fisheries and of Zoology and Chairman of the Department of Fisheries in the School of Natural Resources. John was Professor of Zoology and Curator of Fishes in the Museum of Zoology and Robert was Professor of Zoology and Curator of Fisher in the Museum of Zoology. All were with the University of Michigan at Ann Arbor.

The book "Ichthyology" ISBN 0 471 51165 X can be found in most College Libraries.

It's pretty general information and there was not much information on any one species of fish. A few statements were given on Trout and a few on Black Bass. When I read the trout parts it got me to thinking. Sometimes trout will sip at the water's surface feeding on tiny midge larvae that are stuck in the surface film. Those trout can focus their lens in their eyes on two spots at the same time. And some fish that crawl out of the water can actually see in air as well as under water. Mud skippers were given as an example. Some fish have Binocular Vision so that they can judge depth and distance. the pikes have veritable sighting groove on their snouts in front of the eyes. Two imaginary lines projected from the grooves to cross the head in front of the eyes will include the angle within which a particular species have overlapping visual field, and thus, presumably the field in which the animal has three dimensional vision.

In some experiments where water fleas (Daphnia)are fed to young salmon in low light intensities, the fish assume an oblique position below their prey so as to see them in maximal contrast against the screen afforded by the water surface, watch them move for a few moments and then snap them up one by one. Daphnia are pretty small creatures. They would be hard to see without the air of some type of magnification device. They are not bacterial in size but they are about the size of a head of a pin or smaller.

The book talked about how minnows can see pretty good also.

You can look this information up yourself if you can get a copy of this book on Ichthyology. I found this information above on pages 370 though 381. I skipped a lot of the technical stuff. I would post some of the drawings in here but this forum won't allow me to scan and post pictures. Besides it copyrighted material.

The book was published by John Wiley & Sons, Inc., New York - London and Sydney Australia. You might say it was known worldwide to most fishery biologists and their teachers.

I took a semester of Ichthyology and one of Limnology when I was getting my Degree in Environmental Sciences from Purdue. Before that I studied Pre Veternary Medicine for two years.

I guess that explains why I like to look deeper into the technical reasons of why fish do what they do. I don't mean to bore anyone with this information. It's just that I enjoy knowing the why things work and how they work.

Regards,

Moose1am

[redneckshadrap]

Yep,
Very interesting read Moose...

Thanks
Billy

[Bonefish]

Moose, I have enjoyed your posts. I have found the information both helpful and interesting. Thanks again.

[Moose1am]

Your very welcome.

Moose1am

[apb]

<< I guess that explains why I like to look deeper into the technical reasons of why fish do what they do. I don't mean to bore anyone with this information. It's just that I enjoy knowing the why things work and how they work.

Definitely not a boring read! I also check out the fisheries journals from time to time. Some good stuff to learn from those.

Andrew

[Danny]

First, not normally bored.....

Second, I love the research.

Third, let me add a thought to your hypothesis that the fish are positioning themselves below the fleas to see them. Perhaps the "seeing" is not a regular type vision, but more of a vision constructed by the input of several inputs of vibration, water displacement, and yes regluar sight.

To use this as a proven example of sight would be to say that filter feeders such as the shovel nosed cat fish only swims with its mouth open when the plankton is visible to it. I don't think you can say that.

Does the book discuss the biological build of the eye, or that of the brain, and the brain's ability to process inputs?

I'm not trying to argue, but I have one guy who is acknowledged as an expert who talks of fish disection and study, and an internet "friend"... yes a friend, who does a lot of great research on his own.

BTW, there is no doubt in my mind you have superior knowledge to me in the book study of this field. I am not questioning that. I am merely trying to reconcile two differing opinions.

Thanks again for the great research.

Tight lines and God Bless

Danny

PS, let's just be glad we are having the discussion here instead of on one of the other boards where others would jump in because of preconceived notions!! It's a shame folks can not discuss opposing views with an open mind.

[Moose1am]

Thanks guys.

Danny I agree with you that they use movement and yes vibrations to help them locate their prey. That lateral line is good for triangulating on waves created by things swimming in the water. Even those tiny daphnia will create pressure waves as they swim around in the water.

Not all fish have good eyesight. Some fish are blind. The cave fish that live in total darkness have lost their sight.

Other fish such as the Archer Fish can actually see things out of the water. Trout can also spot a fisherman walking along the bank. They can see out of the water pretty good.

Movement definitely helps the eyes see things. I know that I can see things better if they move especially in the dark. For example one night while I was watching TV and big spider was walking across the carpet between me in the lazy boy and the TV about 10ft away. I didn't know that thing was there until it moved. Another night I was up late and working on the computer in a dark room. The only light in the room came from the computer screen. I noticed something in my peripheral vision and it was a big spider that was crawling along the wall. So movement definitely helps me see things that I may not have seen if they didn't move.

If you deer hunt or rabbit hunt you know that it's easier to spot your prey when they move. If they stand still they blend into the background so well that they are hard to see.


Regards,

Moose1am