Health Insurance Stuff......

[GeoFisher]

You know......in the past, I've had good insurance, GREAT insurance, and CRAPPY insurance......right now, I'm kind of in between.

BUT Here's the deal.

My insurance today is an HSA type Plan with a High Deductible. My deductible is 5000 bucks, and my premiums are about 70 bucks a month, so my MAX out of pocket is 5000 + (70 x 12) or something like $5840.......which is my MAX out of pocket.....When you look at this plan, you think HOLY HELL.......6 GRAND out of pocket....WOW.

BUT lets break it down.....70 bucks + my HSA contribution (450 bucks a month) is what I pay for insurance a month.....TOTAL monthly 520. THAT is a TON of MONEY.............a TON.......

BUT......the HSA money rolls over year to year, just like a savings account. I've been contributing to it for 4 years now, and like my 401K, it is MINE, grows pretax, and I don't pay taxes on it. My wife, kids and I spend about 2500 a year in health care.......AND ALL that is paid out of my HSA, but goes towards my 5k deduct a year.

So.....over the past 4 years, I've contributed 20,000 to my OWN HEALTH CARE, and spent 10,000 on my OWN HEALTH CARE.

If something catastrophic happens, where I need serious work or something, I can meet my deductable for 2 years, and my INSURANCE will take care of me.

BOTTOM LINE........I'm responsible for MY OWN health care......****, what an Idea.

I bet if you compare my HSA to your insurance....and COMPARE what you're really paying, they are pretty close.....


Later,

Geo

[GeoFisher]

One other thing...........I'm still offered other plans, and have had opportunities for HMO's, 80/20 plans, PPO, etc, etc......but those plans all cost similar to the plan above......and the hidden costs, and BS hospitals, and pharmacies, pay with the REAL cost are UNBELIEVABLE.

With the 80/20 plans and PPO's I looked at, the costs were something like this.

* 80 or 90% with 25 dollar copays, and 15 dollar copays on drugs.......
* 2500 deductable
* Premiums from 200-500/month.

Just doing the premium math shows the HSA model may be better......

Like I said......check your own policy and see how it compares.........

AND if you have one of those KILLER/GOLDEN Union negotiated policies, count yourself LUCKY....

[GeoFisher]

One other thing..........ANY money I don't spend on my HEALTH CARE, that is collected in my HSA rolls over and continues to grow...........this is NOT an MSA or a FSA.......HSA's are a completely different BEAST........

Lets hope the Obamunists don't REALLY try to TAX it...........****, that would eliminate the 30% break I get on my contributions.......and will make me go on a gubment plan.

Later,

Geo

[Devils Horse]

George, Mr. Obama wants the folks who pay to take care of their families and themselves to pay for taking care of everyone, including those who've never hit a productive lick in their lives. Nevermind there's an abundance of federal and state sponsored insurance programs available to low income, single parent families, and pretty much anyone who cares enough use it. Our current government will settle for nothing less than some form of social medicine, under government control. You can always tell what government control is, just look for the nearest mindless, expensive and inefficient bureaucratic mess in sight. And voila! You've found it. (Sorry, the Froganese word seemed to fit.)

[JD7.62]

GEO, I have the same Insurance as you and let me tell ya, the intitial sticker shock *****. However, once you sit down and think about it, my insurance really can save me thousands and thousands of dollars.

I plan to contribute enough $ every pay period that by the end of the year I will have enough to meet my deductible. If I dont use it, I will have plenty of money in my HSA to purchase a plan with a higher deductible and lower premioums and keep contributing, so that in the event I need to plop some cash down for a major medical expense I pull out my HSA card (pretty much just like a debit card), swipe it, pay the bill, and my checking account is safe!

[GeoFisher]

GEO, I have the same Insurance as you and let me tell ya, the intitial sticker shock *****. However, once you sit down and think about it, my insurance really can save me thousands and thousands of dollars.

I plan to contribute enough $ every pay period that by the end of the year I will have enough to meet my deductible. If I dont use it, I will have plenty of money in my HSA to purchase a plan with a higher deductible and lower premioums and keep contributing, so that in the event I need to plop some cash down for a major medical expense I pull out my HSA card (pretty much just like a debit card), swipe it, pay the bill, and my checking account is safe!

Yes.....you and I ARE in the same boat.........and the HSA with the DEBIT card really works well......AND I KNOW EXACTLY WHAT I'M PAYING.

NO ******** you pay this because you have insurance, and YOU PAY this because you don't.........Now don't get me wrong.....I ALWAYS let the provider know I'm on a HSA and that those DOLLARS they are charging ME are being PAID by ME.........

We still have some negotiated contracts, because we're a LARGE GROUP, but the days of 5 dollar drugs, and 10 dollar DR visits are OVER.

Later,

Geo

[GeoFisher]

One other thing......the only thing I have not figured out, and worries me is the ONGOING medical issues. If I had an ongoing medical condition that ended up causing lots of visits a year, I'd have a problem meeting the deductable, especially if I was out of work or something.

I still need to figure that out.....but for the most part, I'm with you on re adjusting my plan each year to get a higher and higher deductible........I started out with the 2500, then went to 3600 and am now at 4800.

Later,

Geo

[Grumpy]

HSAs were a good form of health insurance--too bad they won't be around much longer. From what I have seen, I don't think that either the House or the Senate versions touched on them YET, but you can bet that if there is money in them they will figure out some way to tax them. They keep saying that they are not going to tax health insurance premiums but they keep including the tax on premiums in their promotions of how they will pay for the SOCIALIZED HEALTH INSURANCE.

I heard this afternoon how they plan to tax small businesses to pay for the Health Insurance for the poor--real smart to add more taxes on businesses that are laying off people in a recession. Maybe their ultimate plan is to have the government run all businesses (like they are running General Motors, et al)--I think Lenin called that the people's Communism.

Good luck,

Grumpy

[know1]

You know......in the past, I've had good insurance, GREAT insurance, and CRAPPY insurance......right now, I'm kind of in between.

BUT Here's the deal.

My insurance today is an HSA type Plan with a High Deductible. My deductible is 5000 bucks, and my premiums are about 70 bucks a month, so my MAX out of pocket is 5000 + (70 x 12) or something like $5840.......which is my MAX out of pocket.....When you look at this plan, you think HOLY HELL.......6 GRAND out of pocket....WOW.

BUT lets break it down.....70 bucks + my HSA contribution (450 bucks a month) is what I pay for insurance a month.....TOTAL monthly 520. THAT is a TON of MONEY.............a TON.......

BUT......the HSA money rolls over year to year, just like a savings account. I've been contributing to it for 4 years now, and like my 401K, it is MINE, grows pretax, and I don't pay taxes on it. My wife, kids and I spend about 2500 a year in health care.......AND ALL that is paid out of my HSA, but goes towards my 5k deduct a year.

So.....over the past 4 years, I've contributed 20,000 to my OWN HEALTH CARE, and spent 10,000 on my OWN HEALTH CARE.

If something catastrophic happens, where I need serious work or something, I can meet my deductable for 2 years, and my INSURANCE will take care of me.

BOTTOM LINE........I'm responsible for MY OWN health care......****, what an Idea.

I bet if you compare my HSA to your insurance....and COMPARE what you're really paying, they are pretty close.....


Later,

Geo

Your HSA sounds decent.

They tried to offer HSAs at my company this year, but the difference in premium to the worker wasn't enough to make sense to switch so they canned it.

Also, I can't remember the answer to this question, but can you ONLY use the money for medical/prescription costs? Where this comes into play is if you switch jobs and go somewhere that the HSA isn't offerred. Now you have a bunch of money that you can't touch - or don't need to touch because your new employer's insurance is paying it.


I still maintain that the problem is primarily with health INSURANCE and not health CARE.

I believe we should take this away from the employer's responsibility and let people purchase only catastrophic health insurance and pay out of their own pocket for most things healthcare-related.

The advantages are that employers could pay us more to cover those costs, and we'd drive costs down by shopping for our medical services and introducing a concept called competition. Right now, there is no competition due to health insurance. Furthermore, we are all currently paying for our healthcare - it isn't free, but it just doesn't feel like it because it's under the disguise of "insurance" - PLUS paying for the salaries and infrastructure of the health insurance industry.

[Grumpy]

Know1, if you think there is no competition now--just wait until the government is the only one providing health insurance!!

I saw a commercial today about the $400 hammer, the $600 toilet seat, and other things the government has paid for and wondering why we think the government can do it better AND CHEAPER than private industry. Good question.

Grumpy

[Tom523]

Know1, if you think there is no competition now--just wait until the government is the only one providing health insurance!!

I saw a commercial today about the $400 hammer, the $600 toilet seat, and other things the government has paid for and wondering why we think the government can do it better AND CHEAPER than private industry. Good question.

Grumpy

The stories about the hammer and toilet seat amount to peanuts compared to what really gets wasted in government. I work for the government and I've seen close to a million dollars wasted in one afternoon. I reported it to fraud waste and abuse hotline and they said it was an acceptable mistake. It's like Sh** Happen!

[elnutsmalljaws]

Speaking from a patient that has had more hospital bills than probably everybody on the Off Topic board COMBINED, Insurance companies are not the problem THE HOSPITALS, DOCTORS AND THEIR POLICIES ARE THE PROBLEM. I could go into so many billing issues, double billing, multiple doctors doing the same thing at the same time all billing their individual fees, hospitals charging wrong due to coding errors and so forth to the tune of $123,000 in hospital and doctor bills that I owe since 2004 and there has NEVER been one single day that I have not been covered by the BEST plan offered by Kentucky State Government.

For example, I am patient of Blue Surgery Group at UK Hospital. MANY times I have been told to come to UK by my Blue Surgeon on staff to be admitted. I show up to the ER, because that is Hospital policy, I am then sent to the ER seen by an ER doctor and then a 2nd ER doctor as they are full aware that I was told told to come there to be admitted by Blue Surgery after triage, but I am still billed by both ER doctors that do nothing except tell me that Blue Surgery will be down to see me and admit me.

I was in Celina TN this past December and was air lifted out on December 3rd for emergency surger due to an infected abcess in my abdomiinal wall where they drained almost 4 liters of infected fluid. The doctor at the hospital in Celina and the doctor at UK hospital both said it was critical that I get immediate surgery because if it ruptured I could have died. The insurance company agreed that it was critical but because I was flown across state line, what is that about 8 miles from the hospital in Celina to the KY state line which is just past Holly Creek, and it was not pre-approved that I am stuck with the $28,000 helicopter ride. If I was flown to Vanderbilt instead, where nobody knows my case or how the plumbing inside me has been re-routed, versus to where a surgeon knows my plumbing inside and out, they would have paid the full bill.

I was even billed for two surgeons in one of my surgeries where one surgeon did nothing but OBSERVE the procedure, but he still billed my insurance. I did not ask for this surgeon to OBSERVE. My surgeon, who is the best in the state, certainly did not need anyone to OBSERVE him perform his duties. But because this cheesepuff decided to sit in and observe one of my surgeries he felt it was his duty to bill almost $4,000 to my insurance company for his services - AND MY INSURANCE COMPANY PAID IT.

These are just a few of the gross problems with the medical billing and other stuff that has put us $123,000 in debt to medical bills even though I am "supposed" to have a $5,000 MAX out of pocket annually, 2003-2011 is 8 years times $5K is $40,000 if we never paid a nickle to date. Long way between $40,000 and $123,000. There are a lot of people getting rich