why ????????

[HURRICANEBOB]

The Marina's should put up 2 signs. Loading area and preperation area. This would help fix stupid.

I'm think the 2 signs ought to be:

1. "Preparation area for mature, courteous boaters" (Big easy to access area)
2. "Preparation area for jerks" (sign ought be hung over the nearest dumpster)

[HiDefFisherman]

I'm think the 2 signs ought to be:

1. "Preparation area for mature, courteous boaters" (Big easy to access area)
2. "Preparation area for jerks" (sign ought be hung over the nearest dumpster)

LMAO... that's cold... but funny!!!

I'm sure my "ex" would say I belong in number 2.... hmmm, I think that is also what she thinks I am!!!

HDF

[HiDefFisherman]

Here's my question. Why doesn't the state mandate that all boat owners and/or operators have a license to operate a boat. It would consist of a test where courtesy, common sense items and all the rules would come into play. Apparently as I have seen and heard this is very necessary. As well, this would generate more money for the state! As a tournament fisherman that is on the water a lot I see many instances where people just simply don't know what to do and lose their common sense.

I understand this idea, but I don't think our governments need to get any bigger. We can not currently adequately fund our on the water law enforcement, not to mention the really important things, e.g. our social responsibilities of education and social protection. We add another layer to our governments and we just make the government really bigger and slower.

We can in no way fund such an entity with just the wildlife funds.

Hmmm, I better stop now. I am surely stepping up to the conversation that belongs on another forum, not a fishing one.

I do think we as a group of outdoor enthusiates need to work together to help each other out.

One such idea was if we, including me, when fishing alone, what if we help the others load their boats, then we could pull them out of the way, and they in turn could help us launch our boats??

I am the first to get angry, I can admit that, but I also see that is not the answer. Improved cooperation and communication is a much better answer.

HDF

[Fishburn]

I understand this idea, but I don't think our governments need to get any bigger. We can not currently adequately fund our on the water law enforcement, not to mention the really important things, e.g. our social responsibilities of education and social protection. We add another layer to our governments and we just make the government really bigger and slower.

We can in no way fund such an entity with just the wildlife funds.

Hmmm, I better stop now. I am surely stepping up to the conversation that belongs on another forum, not a fishing one.

I do think we as a group of outdoor enthusiates need to work together to help each other out.

One such idea was if we, including me, when fishing alone, what if we help the others load their boats, then we could pull them out of the way, and they in turn could help us launch our boats??

I am the first to get angry, I can admit that, but I also see that is not the answer. Improved cooperation and communication is a much better answer.

HDF

I totally agree that if we all used the "Golden Rule" then this could get better, however, the reason we govern our society is to set common rules that exist for everyone. Courtesy in society seems to be on the way towards extinction, unfortunately. The real issue is educating people on universal safety and etiquette practices for boating. You will always have persons that do not abide by any ideas or rules but the majority will follow the law if it exists. Anyway, too in depth for this post. The first response needs to be patience and a deep breath for we were all there once too. Why does it seem that every day it gets harder for people to see situations through the eyes of others before they react. I know it does me.

[Dave Stewart]

I certainly do not think we need a mandatory licensing program to drive a boat...but I do believe that everyone should have to take and pass the Ky Safe Boating Course and pass the Certification Exam. This would not cure "stupid", nothing cures that, but it would serve to educate many folks that are ignorant of the ways and hows of safe boating. This would not cause a big expense of a large number of influx of new KDFW personnel..this course is available online and once it is passed you can get your certification card for passing the exam for a one time fee on 29.50. This would generate income for the KDFW and the officers could ask to see your card when they check you for your license.

My thinking is that it would educate those that are ignorant of safe boating practices and maybe decrease the number of incidents and accidents caused by ignorance...nothing is going to decrease the number of incidents and accidents caused by stupidity.

[BubbaBass1]

I certainly do not think we need a mandatory licensing program to drive a boat...but I do believe that everyone should have to take and pass the Ky Safe Boating Course and pass the Certification Exam. This would not cure "stupid", nothing cures that, but it would serve to educate many folks that are ignorant of the ways and hows of safe boating. This would not cause a big expense of a large number of influx of new KDFW personnel..this course is available online and once it is passed you can get your certification card for passing the exam for a one time fee on 29.50. This would generate income for the KDFW and the officers could ask to see your card when they check you for your license.

My thinking is that it would educate those that are ignorant of safe boating practices and maybe decrease the number of incidents and accidents caused by ignorance...nothing is going to decrease the number of incidents and accidents caused by stupidity.

Wouldn't that be the same as mandatory licensing?

I agree, If it takes a boating safety course and passing an exam to educate the ignorant. $30 would be worth it.

BB1

[HiDefFisherman]

Wouldn't that be the same as mandatory licensing?

I agree, If it takes a boating safety course and passing an exam to educate the ignorant. $30 would be worth it.

BB1

I too totally agree, $30 is nothing for a good safety education. There exists many problems though, the first off the top of my head is that online courses are bogus. Who knows if I am the one who took the course, or did a friend, or my wife, or my child... who tookt he course? I may have the card, but no proof it was me. This seems nothing more than a way to "tax" us users.

I'm not opposed to the tax, if it is applied to making our resource cleaner, safer, and renewing the resource.

I would support an actual mandatory course, that you have to attend in person, if that is what our soceity wants. I'll stand by my previous stand though. I do respect and totally understand we all have different ideas, and that is what is so great. The more of us that collaborate, the better chance we get a good solution.

This has been a great conversation. I hope somehow our problems will be solved.

Oh, something I just thought of as I was finishing the post. We will never have the mandatory safety class. Why? How in the world will it be applied to all that truly make our "lake" communities survive? The tourists!! Our government will not apply a rule that will limit tourism. Now they may decide to apply the law only to those of us that have KY license on our boats. In doing so though, they will be breaking constitutional law. Again, this is not the place for that discussion. And finally, with several of our waterways bridging multi-state boundries, it would be nearly impossible to try to regulate some type of "safe boater" certification without total cooperation between the states. Heck, we can't get that for even more important stuff. LOL

Thanks to all of you on this post. I love it when the internet experience makes me look at things from different perspectives.

HDF

[HURRICANEBOB]

HDF:

Look at it another way, if the class was required and an operators license was required, then maybe those who don't want to get the license would move out of state.....and mess around on somebody else's lakes.

I agree with the basic premise you make. But, KY doesn't have to play by other states rules, and so could make it mandatory for those who "REGISTER" a boat with KY bow numbers. Given most boaters on our lakes are from KY, would we not at least be attacking the bigger part of the problem?

Incidentally, how do those other folks fish in our lakes when coming from out of state? Don't they have to buy a non-resident, or tourist type 1, 7 or 15 day license? Does that stop them from coming? Nope....so, just add to the webpage a license to use your boat in KY waters, and to get the license, administer a safe boating test right on line. Pass? Get the license to operate during your vacation. Fail.......try again or leave the boat at home. Just my thoughts.......what should be can be!

[HiDefFisherman]

totally agree HB on the visitor's license, but would it be practical to have visitor's safety certification? It's unconstitutional to apply laws to just certain groups of a population. I also agree with you that we would be at least addressing the largest portion of the problem. Just the legal stuff that is in the way.

Also, as you are pointing out about the state of registration. The issue there is this, I know a lot of people who fish at KY Lake, and are residents of IN. But these folks have a "cabin" in KY, so they simply register their boats in KY instead of IN because of tax reasons. This just leaves open another loop hole.

Wow, the more we explore this, the more complicated it gets.

I guess I am just totally opposed to increasing the size of our government.

HDF

[HURRICANEBOB]

[QUOTE=HiDefFisherman;375644]totally agree HB on the visitor's license, but would it be practical to have visitor's safety certification? It's unconstitutional to apply laws to just certain groups of a population.

HDF:

Don't think its applying law to a group of a population. Its regulating a privilege. As KY-ites, we don't have the right to fish in public waters, we have to be granted that privilege, according to law, to do so by acquiring a license. By definition a license may be granted by a party ("licensor") to another party ("licensee") as an element of an agreement between those parties. A shorthand definition of a license is "an authorization (by the licensor) to use the licensed material (by the licensee)."
Laws of one state can apply to non-residents. A state's Sovereignty afforded by the Constitution allows them to regulate all who are within their territorial boundaries, so long as such law does not conflict or undermine federal law. Only fisherman have to buy a fishing license, and fisherman are a portion of the population, but are a portion of the population wishing to be granted a specific privilege to conduct a certain act with in the state.

PS: I gotta stop watching all those lawyer movies :-)

[HiDefFisherman]

Not going to argue HB, I am only going on the information I got in college and from my sister, a lawyer. She's not a particularly good lawyer, so I'll defer to your wisdom!

LOL

HDF

PS, the college courses I took were all in management and marketing, so I am merely considering the discrimination laws and the application of any law that affects a disparaite (spelling??-- it's really the first thing to go) *smile* group of any population. If a law enforcement entity is called upon to "enforce" something, even if it is a privelege license, I think it becomes discrimintory on its face. Ooops, sorry, I tried to stop myself...>LOL

I would imagine HB, that you are probably way more right than me on this. I mean it is late, and I am uhmmmm well I would not be on the water in my condition, so I will throw in the towel. Has to be totally legal.

HDF

[HURRICANEBOB]

HDF,

No arguments here, just enjoyed the exchange of views. Cheers and regards!