In God we Trust

[HURRICANEBOB]

I love this place!

I learn more from it everyday, some serious history here!

Peter, Do I have to pay tuition to stay a member

[GeoFisher]

Looks like Roadtoad pretty much supplied my response to Geo. I'll just add that in 2006 congress again reaffirmed that in god we trust is the US motto (50th anniversery of the law originally being passed). My comment had nothing to do with what the motto is. Simply, does congress really need to waste time reaffirming a law that is already on the books and that was already reaffirmed 5 years ago? Seriously, the country is headed down the crapper and rather than spend time/money on actually doing something that will fix any of the many problems we have, congress decides to waste time/money on something that is merely symbolic and a campaine ploy.

Andrew

It took less than 30 minutes..........30 MINUTES.

I thought it was a nice gesture.....but I guess you're right. It is simply TOO **** BAD that a gesture such as voting to keep GOD in our hearts and where it belongs gets so much heat from the left.

But you know what, I'm done with it.

Later,

Geo

[GeoFisher]

Geo,

Sometimes it really irks me how you throw inaccurate statements out there, with nothing to back them up, and let me do your fact-checking for you, but what the hell, I guess we both learn something from it.

"You make it sound like this was magically approved in 1956, but In God we Trust has been our motto since the early 1800's."

NOT true. The phrase wasn't even conceived until Abraham Lincoln's administration, and didn't appear on any currency until 1864.
http://www.treasury.gov/about/educat...-we-trust.aspx

"The Congress passed the Act of April 22, 1864. This legislation changed the composition of the one-cent coin and authorized the minting of the two-cent coin. The Mint Director was directed to develop the designs for these coins for final approval of the Secretary. IN GOD WE TRUST first appeared on the 1864 two-cent coin..."

"...The use of IN GOD WE TRUST has not been uninterrupted. The motto disappeared from the five-cent coin in 1883, and did not reappear until production of the Jefferson nickel began in 1938. Since 1938, all United States coins bear the inscription. Later, the motto was found missing from the new design of the double-eagle gold coin and the eagle gold coin shortly after they appeared in 1907. In response to a general demand, Congress ordered it restored, and the Act of May 18, 1908, made it mandatory on all coins upon which it had previously appeared. IN GOD WE TRUST was not mandatory on the one-cent coin and five-cent coin. It could be placed on them by the Secretary or the Mint Director with the Secretary's approval. The motto has been in continuous use on the one-cent coin since 1909, and on the ten-cent coin since 1916. It also has appeared on all gold coins and silver dollar coins, half-dollar coins, and quarter-dollar coins struck since July 1, 1908.
A law passed by the 84th Congress (P.L. 84-140) and approved by the President on July 30, 1956, the President approved a Joint Resolution of the 84th Congress, declaring IN GOD WE TRUST the national motto of the United States. IN GOD WE TRUST was first used on paper money in 1957, when it appeared on the one-dollar silver certificate..."

It has NOT been the US motto for 200 years. It has been appearing on SOME of our currency, not all, since 1864, not quite 150 years yet, and it has not yet been our national motto for 50 years. Those are FACTS.


"Here is some reading for you:

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/religion/rel06.html"

Interesting reading. I'm not quite sure what you're trying to prove though?


"AND if banning the 10 Commandments has not been going on, then, what do you call this?

http://www.gainesville.com/article/2...CLES/110719637"

I call that upholding the First Amendment. Those folks are free to display the 10 Commandments on any private property they wish, so there is no "ban" on them. They simply have to abide by the Constitution when they do so.

One last question. Just what is it we should all be so darned SCARED about?

We will just have to agree to disagree on this one.......

I guess you really didn't read too much of what I stated. I said that in 1864 THAT was when In God We Trust was enacted, but it really started in 1812 when our NATIONAL ANTHEM was penned.

And with regards to this:

http://www.loc.gov/exhibits/religion/rel06.html"

It is specific examples of just HOW our founding fathers thought about religion and religion in government. You've posted quite a bit about how Jefferson really was apposed to mixing the two, yet if you read the posts, you will see that his separation letters are COMPLETELY taken out of context. I guess you didn't see that.

And as DJD stated.....why has it became a national pastime in the past 20 years to remove the 10 commandments from court houses?? WHY in the past 20 years are they banning prayer at commencement ceremonies?? WHY in the past 20 years are the disallowing the very mention of God in school??

Personally, if you look at the deterioration of our communities over the past 20 years, there are some pretty direct correlations. Maybe you're wrong...........

Later,

Geo

[jcb]

I guess you really didn't read too much of what I stated. I said that in 1864 THAT was when In God We Trust was enacted, but it really started in 1812 when our NATIONAL ANTHEM was penned.

The Star Spangled Banner didn't become our National Anthem until 1931. It was a relatively obscure song before the Navy started using it. Before that, other songs served its patriotic purpose, including "My Country, 'Tis of Thee".

[jcb]

And as DJD stated.....why has it became a national pastime in the past 20 years to remove the 10 commandments from court houses?? WHY in the past 20 years are they banning prayer at commencement ceremonies?? WHY in the past 20 years are the disallowing the very mention of God in school??

Personally, if you look at the deterioration of our communities over the past 20 years, there are some pretty direct correlations. Maybe you're wrong...........

Later,

Geo

I'm not crazy about these developments either, but I also believe that God being "kicked out" of schools and public places is not a cause, but an effect of American Christians kicking God out of their own personal lives. The reality is, if Christians were truly living out their faith, it wouldn't matter whether kids could pray in school, or we could erect a monument to the 10 Commandments in the town square. God would be in all those places.

[apb]

...
And as DJD stated.....why has it became a national pastime in the past 20 years to remove the 10 commandments from court houses?? WHY in the past 20 years are they banning prayer at commencement ceremonies?? WHY in the past 20 years are the disallowing the very mention of God in school??...

The recognition that there are a number of different religions practiced by many in the US. Why exclude some of those people just because they do not share your religious beliefs? Religion is a personal thing, it should be taught by the parents/church, not public schools. The founding fathers recognized that when they created the 1st amendment against the estalishment of a state sponsered religion. Public schools, courthouses and the like are extensions of the government. They cannot promote one religion over another. The 10 commandments is very specific to one religion. I.e., such things as thou shall not have any other god before me (does that mean it is recognized that there are multiple gods?) is specific to one religion. Courts have to apply the law of the land, not of one religion, therefore symbols of one religion have no place in a US court.

...
Personally, if you look at the deterioration of our communities over the past 20 years, there are some pretty direct correlations. Maybe you're wrong...........

Correlation does not equate with causation. I don't doubt that there is a deterioration of our communities. It may have something to do with lack of religion, everything to do with lack of religion, nothing to do with the lack of religion. If religion is the answer to societies ills, why the problems that we've seen in various religions (pedophile priets comes to mind)? If religion cannot cure the ills of those most directly involved with it, then how can it cure the ills of those who are far removed from it? Yep, I may be wrong, you may be wrong, we all may be wrong.

Andrew

[Tim_T]

It took less than 30 minutes..........30 MINUTES.

I thought it was a nice gesture.....but I guess you're right. It is simply TOO **** BAD that a gesture such as voting to keep GOD in our hearts and where it belongs gets so much heat from the left.

But you know what, I'm done with it.

Later,

Geo

imo what is too **** bad is that our congress waste time on this when all it amounts to is symbolism. I love how everyone calls their self Christian and wants to live by Christian values, but yet they tend to ignore them when it matters. It is ridiculous that our elected officials waste their time playing politics like this, but it works so effectively because people see some importance in this symbolism.