Where are the Americans

[DJD]

Greed doesn't motivate me, but thanks for trying to paint me in that light. I'll tell you what does motivate me - raising my kids to become productive citizens that know right from wrong. Thats why I go to work every day. I don't try to live like an NFL superstar on my salary. If I did, I'd be in the same boat as the trash collector that tries to live like a neurosurgeon. When I lived in college I lived like I had no money. I plucked fish out of cedar creek in auburn indiana for food, drove a beat up saturn and walked up to the hospital breakroom if I wanted to watch tv. A lot of people have a distorted view when it comes to needs vs wants. Plenty of money for smokes, rims, gadgets, bigger houses than necessary, newer cars, nice clothes, etc. but not enough money for the rent/house note or food. Flat screen tv's, dish network, iPhone 6, high speed internet, going to the movies and eating out three times a week aren't necessities like advertisers would have you believe. Oxygen, some form of roof over your head, water, and food are necessities. If you truly can't afford the latter with your job, then yeah, take a handout, on me. No problem with that whatsoever. How many people do you see griping about having no money post it on an online forum of some sort from their smartphone? Check any relevant comments section from a yahoo article sometime. You had the money for Internet and the time to post about it.

Do you really think if the minimum wage is raised employers won't reduce jobs and raise costs to offset the wage increase?

I was thinking the same thing and almost posted something like this. Spot on man.

You know.....I been thinking about buying a boat for years and I mean looking until I get so excited I almost toss my plan out the window and say heck with it I'm getting one now! I am waiting for $650 a month child support to end in May before I get something. I can't afford to do it now without messing with my budget that I give myself after all the other things are taken care of.

Will i go out and buy a fancy Bassboat with seat warmers and wifi? Nope! I'll buy what I want which is a used boat that fits into my new budget after I take care of the things I need to take care of. My point is I could spend myself past my means and live like there is no tomorrow and convince myself that I need that $85k bassboat/$65k truck and go broke in a year or two and blame others that I can't afford what I deserve!!!....or I can use my 1995 Chevy and buy a used boat. This way I still save for retirement, health insurance, rainy day fund and can afford my mortgage, auto insurance, bills and escort services(kidding!) and have money left over for Golf, guns, Rodsand reels, knives and other necessities!

[Hlleonard]

So that's the answer huh? A company pays its $20 per hour guy $$40 per hour and his $40 per hour $60? Random numbers but still what do you thing would happen to their goods or services they provide? Think it will increase in price? How about companies who drive trucks for a living....will they demand better pay? How about the auto makers.....think they will charge more since they are paying their employees twice as much?? Of course this imaginary scenario can go on and on but in the end all we have done is raise the reference. I mean if $20 an hour households can't afford life and all of a sudden they can at $40 an hour don't you thing all the good and services they use has gone up and they are back to the same situation??
This experiment you speak of doesn't work. We just lived through it. Obamacare and fuel...two of the highest demands on our company in the last 10 years has made us change a few things. Did we go out and pay our guys more because of either drain? Nope, we raised our labor rates, enacted a trip charge and it still not enough. To combat health insurance we get smaller bonuses and at some point will prolly be on the gubment teat. Looks like a diabolical plan to me by obama. Get into private health insurance and make it expensive as hell and people will come to gubment for their seemingly cheaper version.

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Our nightmares seldom make it to reality... Seems I can remember when the middle class was stronger and I don't remember the sky falling... We (meaning all of us including the left and the right) whine more and more as the economy gets worse and that whining has gotten worse with the weakening of the middle class... it seems 2x2 never equals 4 to anybody... Pay better wages and our economy and our dependence of gov handouts get better but you guys think more soup lines for the lower class and more of the countries resources moving to the top is the ticked.... The richer the top gets the more our country will deteriorate and that can be traced to you guys hero and the worst enemy of the economy.... I hope the Reagans of the country never find their way back into power...

[riverrat12]

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Our nightmares seldom make it to reality... Seems I can remember when the middle class was stronger and I don't remember the sky falling... We (meaning all of us including the left and the right) whine more and more as the economy gets worse and that whining has gotten worse with the weakening of the middle class... it seems 2x2 never equals 4 to anybody... Pay better wages and our economy and our dependence of gov handouts get better but you guys think more soup lines for the lower class and more of the countries resources moving to the top is the ticked.... The richer the top gets the more our country will deteriorate and that can be traced to you guys hero and the worst enemy of the economy.... I hope the Reagans of the country never find their way back into power...

You truly don't get it...INFLATING the dollar is not the answer! As far as Reagan goes at least when he was president I was Proud to be American...Now....not so much.

[Hlleonard]

Any of that so called raping being done by Liberals? Any Liberal CEO making millions in bonuses? Any Liberal who does well means that "trickle down" worked or is it still unfair and evil?

Oh i have a clue since I still work for a living where as your retired and past your money making years. I comment based more on what I experience as opposed to some propaganda by either party. Your scenarios of making us all get better pay with Unions controlling us sounds an awful like having the gubment take care of us. Why do we need a group directly controlling what we do? Can't we be responsible for our actions and live with the consequences of our actions? Union members can hide behind their union card and if the gubment controlled everything how would we clean up the losers?? Hell we can't do it now!!!

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Left or right, ceo's are a disease that has been growing for the last 30 or 40 years with no hope of a cure.... Trickle down has no political bias, it allows all businesses to funnel assets from the bottom to the top and has for a good many years under the precept of businesses prospering will somehow not find its way into the bank accounts of those at the top and nowhere else.. Has worked about as well wings on pigs... Unions have a bad side which I have never denied but along with the weakening of the unions comes the economy we are constantly whining about, again 2x2 never equals 4... Being responsible for ourselves doesn't seem to be working very well does it..

[psprowler]

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Being responsible for ourselves doesn't seem to be working very well does it..

When in the last 20 or so years has the whole of society been doing this? I musta been texting on my phone when all that and U2 becoming a super musical group was going down. Can someone give me the cliffs notes version of what happened?

[mhall]

Good jobs don't go begging.

Nobody is begging and I find that insulting. You are quite frankly a idiot with some of things you post. I blame it on your meds though.

[DJD]

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Left or right, ceo's are a disease that has been growing for the last 30 or 40 years with no hope of a cure.... Trickle down has no political bias, it allows all businesses to funnel assets from the bottom to the top and has for a good many years under the precept of businesses prospering will somehow not find its way into the bank accounts of those at the top and nowhere else.. Has worked about as well wings on pigs... Unions have a bad side which I have never denied but along with the weakening of the unions comes the economy we are constantly whining about, again 2x2 never equals 4... Being responsible for ourselves doesn't seem to be working very well does it..

I don't remember all the aspects of trickle down economics but to say it didn't work seems foolish. It did work pretty well when Ronny needs it to...didn't it? I also the the basic idea of people spending more when they have more to spend is true. Unfortunately, when some folks get money they don't understand the need to save some. Your disgust with RR prolly runs as deep as mine for Obama.

Tax cuts are or were extended to companies to this day and some may say well that's the problem! The gubment doesn't have the revenue it needs to operate but I say the gubment could take double the taxes they do and still run out of money because that is what they do. They spend money that they take from us. The more they take the more they spend. Obama increases gubment like crazy because he believes we can't be trusted with our own lives (maybe an overstatement but I don't like him or anybody that does)

I will admit I don't read about financial history or different economic theory's because they bore me. I also don't spend a ton of time researching topics on here that pop up but like I said before I usually look at my situation and my circle of friends(both of them) family and see how we live. I can understand what they have done in life and what life has done to them and I don't see the gloom and doom of RR popping up in our conversations. Now, obama is another story......he proves that mistakes, arrogance, ignorance, stupidity, lies, deceit, Cranius rectumus and racism has no color preference.

So you are saying that if RR and trickle down would have not existed we would be in a much better situation? Federal debt potentially lower? Household incomes much better and ceo's not taking home millions of dollars in bonuses? You feel we would all be doing much better? I don't see how that can be. We would have to excuse so many things in history which is impossible. To start with how would we excuse Jimmy Carter? Obama?

[roadrunner]

mhall here is your answer they are all waiting for there unemployment to run out.
END OF EXTENDED UNEMPLOYMENT BENEFITS CREDITED FOR JOB SURGE
WashEx: “Sixty percent of job creation in 2014 was caused by the expiration of unemployment benefits, according to a new working paper published by the National Bureau of Economic Research. In late 2013, a standoff between Republicans and Democrats led to the abrupt expiration of long-term unemployment benefits. Democrats warned that the expiration would have disastrous ramifications, but Republicans had long argued that allowing Americans to collect unemployment benefits for an indefinite period of time provided a disincentive for them to work. The new working paper found that the expiration of benefits was responsible for the creation of over 1.8 million jobs. Nearly 1 million of those jobs were created by workers who would have otherwise stayed out of the labor force if unemployment benefits had been extended. Overall, almost 3 million jobs were created in 2014.”

[kygorski]

Whats insulting abouit that groucho? If you have a wonderfull place to work, you should have all the help you need. Why don't you? I had bad jobs, and kept looking, is that a crime? If I would have stuck with a no where job, I wouldn't have been able to send my kids to good schools, and help with their college education. And I pay for my meds. you don't, so please don't let that bother you.

[Hlleonard]

Does anybody here believe the lower and middle class are in better shape today that they were before reaganomics?

Does anybody here believe the upper class hasn't gained wealth as compared to the other two?

Does anybody here believe the end result is not directly caused by the idea that if you let the rich make all the money they can they will allow that to "trickle down"?... sure they will but only if you are able to force that trickle down.

Does anybody here believe cutting those taxes did not lead to the debt boondongle we have today, if you do. look at the top tax rates before and after reagan... trickle down was a sham that only benefited the wealthy.

Does anybody remember what Bush1 referred to trickle down as?
31 percent: Top tax rate in 1991
50 percent: Top tax rate in 1986
70 percent: Top tax rate in 1980
91 percent: Top tax rate in 1963

[psprowler]

Does anybody here believe the lower and middle class are in better shape today that they were before reaganomics?

Does anybody here believe the upper class hasn't gained wealth as compared to the other two?

Does anybody here believe the end result is not directly caused by the idea that if you let the rich make all the money they can they will allow that to "trickle down"?... sure they will but only if you are able to force that trickle down.

Does anybody here believe cutting those taxes did not lead to the debt boondongle we have today, if you do. look at the top tax rates before and after reagan... trickle down was a sham that only benefited the wealthy.

Does anybody remember what Bush1 referred to trickle down as?
31 percent: Top tax rate in 1991
50 percent: Top tax rate in 1986
70 percent: Top tax rate in 1980
91 percent: Top tax rate in 1963

As a mere sperm cell I was not able to come to any conclusions about wealth distribution amongst classes before Reagan became president. I just know that you can't artificially inflate something like wages and not expect those wages to be offset by an increase in cost, reduction in workforce or both. Raising minimum wage at a place like McDonald's for example from 7.25 to 15 dollars - you are getting the same exact production from the worker - they aren't going to magically start cranking out 100 more hamburgers per hour. The owner would still like to make a profit because after all, he put in the hard work and took the investment risks of owning his own business. So what's he going to do?

It's greed on both ends. On the top end the executive has to make 1.5 billion instead of 1.25 billion and on the low end it's entitlement greed. Everybody has "x" so I deserve to have "x" as well. Then I buy "x" with money I didn't have and now I don't have enough to buy "y" which I actually need. The priorities are not in order whatsoever. Most folks could made ends meet if they made better decisions with their money. However that doesn't start at age 30 or 40 when for most that's too late. It starts early in life. Virtually every decision you make in life has consequences. There is no "reset" button, although the government is doing their best to try and create one.

There will always be poor people. There will always be rich people. I don't care if the CEO is snorting coke off a strippers back on a yacht somewhere in the South Pacific while filming it in HD for later viewing on a 106" projector screen.

[psprowler]

And to kygorski's point I think he does make a valid one. Good jobs don't go begging. They have to be earned and are not just given. If that's the point he was trying to make I agree. Don't always agree with him, but do in this instance.